From lojban+bncCNTPpI2KGxDnv_rdBBoEihVBig@googlegroups.com Thu Apr 08 20:33:21 2010 Received: from mail-qy0-f166.google.com ([209.85.221.166]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O04y4-00030I-Ad for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:33:20 -0700 Received: by qyk38 with SMTP id 38sf1784475qyk.1 for ; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:33:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:received:received:from:to:subject:date:user-agent :references:in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; bh=EMnuetO0WGo9IxeWhIoCcqzflGNrPL9Y3mkaJDqeDRI=; b=TkbcPrJ4trCoZ17Xb+uLb+DL8j6fAhMjuUv5/eLVXczgA91tMFf86NhhNbIK+ST1B2 x/6Gad9ydByH5xryvrbm1vue0n+YcXUE4R7HZUuHSarWw87YxlX6tzgrtKX5oh02tkne CFA0dY0K5t/FMGN6XYPLKqWtvXCClySUrWSp0= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=smUPr7fDqg8Q6n7Jrqf0AN8Yj+okhRI0S+ca3aQa3d1X7rd24/LHTI682y9db7HTQT go/tq8x7dQ18/s7QEEPGZnLXYEtk9X2RAwDFi1pIy+0Y9ygj3JDQ1NxldYISO29WzLtA medKjBZ5csWHdPMk1xrpT3+0nK03u3g9NSUZQ= Received: by 10.229.2.31 with SMTP id 31mr32098qch.42.1270783975408; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:32:55 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.50.82 with SMTP id y18ls39620qcf.1.p; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.233.68 with SMTP id jx4mr81235qcb.28.1270783973791; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.233.68 with SMTP id jx4mr81234qcb.28.1270783973716; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.121]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 19si114479qyk.13.2010.04.08.20.32.53; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 20:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.121 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.121; X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=BcrMeMh1FZ8f+Yn0DMFpCYxUD07jTIHG6/eaijgkUbY= c=1 sm=0 a=f8h2ccynpPgA:10 a=ORa4HqFjfvEA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=ITGCJgwGTuG7H/gKGaarIQ==:17 a=VuakU_8lOnCbZWDrV7MA:9 a=HI8lUJ1feqo2HaSPy4t2yId5KlgA:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=ITGCJgwGTuG7H/gKGaarIQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 71.71.198.100 Received: from [71.71.198.100] ([71.71.198.100:51566] helo=chausie) by cdptpa-oedge04.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.2.39 r()) with ESMTP id 65/81-28131-5EF9EBB4; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 03:32:53 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F330136E3 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 23:32:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Response ro Robin's "Essay on the future of Lojban" Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 23:32:48 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <4BBE188B.8070807@lojban.org> <20100409014708.GB11541@digitalkingdom.org> In-Reply-To: <20100409014708.GB11541@digitalkingdom.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201004082332.50387.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.121 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/33d26e8385fed297 X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/dca0ef9b3bad290e Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Thursday 08 April 2010 21:47:09 Robin Lee Powell wrote: > One place where we differ is that I no longer think usage should > decide *ever*. Unless the BPFK becomes totally controlled by a pack > of drooling morons, of course usage will be acknowledged and > respected, and the BPFK may *choose* to promote usage to the status > of officialness, but we should not let the language drift via usage. > It should be well specified. What will happen once there is a critical mass of verclijbo? > I also don't think that describing the lanugage is what we > should be doing. We should be *declaring* the language. Does this include declaring the meaning of lujvo and fu'ivla? > I disagree. You can have a large, popular language without it being > subject to random, unfettered linguistic; see, for example, French. Twenty years ago the AF declared an orthographic reform. (The way I found o= ut=20 about it was seeing the word "cig=FCe" (hemlock (umbellifer), new spelling)= in=20 Wiktionary.) Some parts of the reform I agree with ("cigu=EB" looks strange= =20 with the dieresis on the silent letter), some I don't ("co=FBt" (cost) shou= ld=20 retain the circumflex because it represents a lost "s"). Can we have some= =20 Lojbanists accepting some, but not all, of the rulings of the BPFK? Pierre --=20 Don't buy a French car in Holland. It may be a citroen. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.