From lojban+bncCIXohuTaHxCyyv3dBBoEjcfmQQ@googlegroups.com Fri Apr 09 10:35:08 2010 Received: from mail-yx0-f140.google.com ([209.85.210.140]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O0I6h-0002pP-Rq for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:35:08 -0700 Received: by yxe4 with SMTP id 4sf1649233yxe.28 for ; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:date:received:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tJ85yxMTxDIKne7nMkSNHchl7EALssO/ss7cRACsFqg=; b=upxXDUMEDROoJksonru1+FLy4tWP4ISqABg7t7/O46axN/2ba9zbRe/xJHL5USVJpk RqPCS6AcXkpXCL4SG7pMrxKwKaCkRTrtURPTbvvfw4o4hGw6z2uMnpS2rwFYMnEwYBQf 61FxCr5ofxny8S3AskldSLPrJGDbMWYF4ALCY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=t3DVYHOoIs47ozSHuopdB1AYaAaKIjBcuPHkml4x9xtsGYvmFka+SWHrjseUjcm81M oifapUT2/aK8LPNxQQkQ3gyUSiNZNFTthEYamxJmUElLwSoCkw8L0iMc++HxNPRjhmb7 OUkS5oI2eJmnXGVeZzYWpju99HD+Hpn+Omxrg= Received: by 10.91.121.9 with SMTP id y9mr97364agm.33.1270834482575; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:42 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.51.234 with SMTP id e42ls199743ibg.2.p; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.168.204 with SMTP id v12mr53552iby.4.1270834480783; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.168.204 with SMTP id v12mr53551iby.4.1270834480733; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iw0-f184.google.com (mail-iw0-f184.google.com [209.85.223.184]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 18si236188iwn.11.2010.04.09.10.34.39; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of matt.mattarn@gmail.com designates 209.85.223.184 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.223.184; Received: by iwn14 with SMTP id 14so2345942iwn.22 for ; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.143.3.1 with HTTP; Fri, 9 Apr 2010 10:34:39 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20100405210225.GW6084@digitalkingdom.org> <4BBC3CE4.6080803@lojban.org> <4BBDECA2.5000500@lojban.org> <4BBE0713.6030903@lojban.org> <20100409002127.GA11541@digitalkingdom.org> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 13:34:39 -0400 Received: by 10.142.210.15 with SMTP id i15mr288524wfg.256.1270834479524; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 10:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: [lojban-announcements] Essay on the future of Lojban, with a simple poll for the community. From: Matt Arnold To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of matt.mattarn@gmail.com designates 209.85.223.184 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=matt.mattarn@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: matt.mattarn@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/c67f210addc06a0c X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/366934c114f2668a Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Christopher, Lojban has no goal of being widely used. It can be logical and consistent while also being mindbendingly unusable. That is its past, current, and continuing plan. -Matt On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:32 PM, Christopher Doty wro= te: > On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 17:21, Robin Lee Powell > wrote: >> >> Acutally, no, I meant exactly what I said: Lojban was formed to test >> the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis, and while that's largely irrelevant to >> me, it *is* important to me, and many other people, that Lojban is >> not like any natural languages in a lot of respects. =A0Makes it all >> mind-stretching and stuff. > > This is an interesting issue, I think, because I see the idea of > "mind-bending stuff," while certainly very cool, to be diametrically oppo= sed > to any hope of having Lojban widely adopted as an > international/auxiliary/talking-to-computers/whatever language--there are > plenty of things that natural languages do which are plenty mind-bending = to > speakers of English, but they don't violate general principles of what > languages do and what they don't do, while Lojban does in any number of > respects. > If Lojban wants to be mind-bending, awesome. If it wants to be a language > which is logical and consistent, and thus primed to make in-roads in bein= g > widely used, also awesome. =A0But it can't do both of those things. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.