From lojban+bncCMHEmaCOBhDRo_7dBBoE5V-NfQ@googlegroups.com Fri Apr 09 13:45:38 2010 Received: from mail-gw0-f61.google.com ([74.125.83.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O0L54-0001O7-B7 for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:38 -0700 Received: by gwj21 with SMTP id 21sf1742489gwj.16 for ; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:date:received:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=jMJwqs/JSnVtDuoTZ7m5JVEbhqwRC7kHRvQ4wZ/+EzQ=; b=XIBjQzNer+1ymn34mugjqVqZddOxPkn16DTPvYMTfGz4pple4Bi89uU5xH4icFrCAd rlD/18JJLO0MobPYJz+v0TJxiI6xEqUsqr1eeDPrf6HOwqYCWX07cpjbTkZ/nALt+ffY fEHGiP+OXyoxBVcAkxRnq/Yq/ioQgF8KFpK/c= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=H37ET4BrAZgVY5KQgFMbxLukQ66/JTL1BJqAsXMugk1g0h0DNzYNe3i7PKzlPr6SJ1 +hzLW0OmUNXjjE/BVZuN6dz7/NN08OXykb+QA1v7PvoAcMxIpmavM2guGaS94FpaZ2bu TKrVKxfg4vj/ag3V0JZVPiOu43k+CV++rNKEY= Received: by 10.91.91.8 with SMTP id t8mr149090agl.16.1270845905179; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:05 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.204.32.206 with SMTP id e14ls413890bkd.2.p; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.136.79 with SMTP id q15mr41691bkt.33.1270845903056; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.136.79 with SMTP id q15mr41690bkt.33.1270845902980; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wy0-f170.google.com (mail-wy0-f170.google.com [74.125.82.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id v26si1835935bkt.3.2010.04.09.13.45.01; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:01 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.170; Received: by wyb34 with SMTP id 34so603805wyb.29 for ; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:01 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.30.146 with HTTP; Fri, 9 Apr 2010 13:45:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20100409203413.GS3000@nvg.org> References: <20100409195044.GR3000@nvg.org> <20100409203413.GS3000@nvg.org> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 14:45:01 -0600 Received: by 10.216.160.213 with SMTP id u63mr332147wek.128.1270845901652; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 13:45:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Cultural gismu replacement lujvo now on jbovlaste. From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/97387d388c4148fc X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/60939e695c5d1a0 Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e6541b048844440483d3de01 --0016e6541b048844440483d3de01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 2:34 PM, Arnt Richard Johansen wrote: > On Fri, Apr 09, 2010 at 01:59:23PM -0600, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:50 PM, Arnt Richard Johansen > wrote: > > > > > On Fri, Apr 09, 2010 at 01:44:01PM -0600, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > > language - matybau - "m1 corresponds to language of m2/b2 in aspect > > > > m3" > > > > culture - matklu - "m1 corresponds to culture of m2/k1 in aspect > > > > m3" > > > > community - matce'u - "m1 corresponds to community m2/c2 in aspect > > > > m3" > > > > religion - matyjda - "m1 corresponds to religion of m2/l2 in aspec= t > > > > m3/l3" > > > > nationality - matselgu'e - "m1/sg1 corresponds to country m2/sg2 in > > > aspect > > > > m3" > > > > geography - matytutra "m1 corresponds to territory of m2/t2 in aspe= ct > > > > m3" > > > > > > These are all based on veljvo that are backwards. For that place > structure > > > to follow jvojva, the words would have to be banmapti, klumapti, and = so > on. > > > > > > > Oh well. I did it that way to emphasize the correspondence bit. > > Okay, but it is the final part of the compound that is the most salient > part. > > > > Also, the =93mapti=94 seems like a semantic no-op=97why not just use = bangu, > > > kulnu, and so on? > > > > > > > This is why: > > > > bangu "x1 is a/the language/dialect used by x2 to express/communicate x= 3" > > > > Say this without using {mapti}: > > > > zoi gy. Yumpto .gy matybau lo merko > > I'm not sure I've understood that sentence correctly. > > zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. srana lo bangu be lo merko > > or > > zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. merko lo ka bangu > Right, but these words are meant to replace the cultural gismu such as merko. (I know I used it too. I suppose I should've said {zo'oi Yumpto matybau la.amerikan.}) > > or, if I make some assumptions about what =93Yumpto=94 is (I don't know w= hat it > is, but a web search suggests that the following sentence is true): > > zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. valsi fi lo glibau be lo merko > Yes. It's slang. As in, "I'm going to the movies. Yumpto? (You want to?)" > > -- > Arnt Richard Johansen http://arj.nvg.org/ > If you connect yourself across a 2000V supply, the very best you can > hope for is something like a serious heart attack with severe burns > thrown in for good measure. IT'S MUCH MORE LIKELY THAT YOU'LL BE DEAD. > -- John Nelson: Power Supplies & Control Units, in The VHF/UHF DX Book > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > > --=20 mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --0016e6541b048844440483d3de01 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 2:34 PM, Arnt Richard Joh= ansen <arj@nvg.org&= gt; wrote:
On Fri, Apr 09, 2010 at 01:59:23PM -0600, Jonathan Jones = wrote:
> On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:50 PM, Arnt Richard Johansen <arj@nvg.org> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Apr 09, 2010 at 01:44:01PM -0600, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > language - matybau - "m1 corresponds to language of m2/= b2 in aspect
> > > m3"<http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matybau>
> > > culture - matklu - "m1 corresponds to culture of m2/k1 = in aspect
> > > m3"<http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matklu>
> > > community - matce'u - "m1 corresponds to community = m2/c2 in aspect
> > > m3"<http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matce%27u>=
> > > =A0religion - matyjda - "m1 corresponds to religion of = m2/l2 in aspect
> > > m3/l3"<http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matyjda><= br> > > > nationality - matselgu'e - "m1/sg1 corresponds to c= ountry m2/sg2 in
> > aspect
> > > m3" <http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matselgu%27e<= /a>>
> > > geography - matytutra "m1 corresponds to territory of m= 2/t2 in aspect
> > > m3"<http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/matytutra>=
> >
> > These are all based on veljvo that are backwards. For that place = structure
> > to follow jvojva, the words would have to be banmapti, klumapti, = and so on.
> >
>
> Oh well. I did it that way to emphasize the correspondence bit.

Okay, but it is the final part of the compound that is the most salie= nt part.

> > Also, the =93mapti=94 seems like a semantic no-op=97why not just = use bangu,
> > kulnu, and so on?
> >
>
> This is why:
>
> bangu "x1 is a/the language/dialect used by x2 to express/communi= cate x3"
>
> Say this without using {mapti}:
>
> zoi gy. Yumpto .gy matybau lo merko

I'm not sure I've understood that sentence correctly.

=A0 zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. srana lo bangu be lo merko

or

=A0 zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. merko lo ka bangu

Right,= but these words are meant to replace the cultural gismu such as merko. (I = know I used it too. I suppose I should've said {zo'oi Yumpto matyba= u la.amerikan.})

or, if I make some assumptions about what =93Yumpto=94 is (I don't know= what it is, but a web search suggests that the following sentence is true)= :

=A0 zoi .gy. Yumpto .gy. valsi fi lo glibau be lo merko

Yes. It's slang. As in, "I'm going to the movies. Yumpt= o? (You want to?)"

--
Arnt Richard Johansen =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 = =A0 =A0 =A0http://arj.nvg= .org/
If you connect yourself across a 2000V supply, the very best you can<= br> hope for is something like a serious heart attack with severe burns
thrown in for good measure. IT'S MUCH MORE LIKELY THAT YOU'LL BE DE= AD.
-- John Nelson: Power Supplies & Control Units, in The VHF/UHF DX Book<= br>
--
You received this message because = you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.




--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu
=

--
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