From 3lK7ESwsJBlM6F5zvwzC1z817v36.x97694wv819916z1C9FAD.x97@groups.bounces.google.com Tue Apr 13 10:49:33 2010 Received: from mail-pv0-f189.google.com ([74.125.83.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <3lK7ESwsJBlM6F5zvwzC1z817v36.x97694wv819916z1C9FAD.x97@groups.bounces.google.com>) id 1O1kEo-0000Jx-J9; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:31 -0700 Received: by pvb32 with SMTP id 32sf1990709pvb.16 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:date:received:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=ErqEpOVUJx4v4R6lFZ+pGMmD729pAc0j7WBWzOTjO+E=; b=i77PXE09pUOCghplYJ9mIZWuy13NMtxf+5kLQJtab9klU3Cy/C/9ZjAU8chj9Zwzn5 9KsAnEWwxYu4krN/N02U5FzJw7DxSk0miiU736cm5LipYQ7XSQPuuXopwpaFr5ilr0Cj vh99C+00gVgpkKSbT3YTBmR3J65d/oVzU5DGQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=fuMS5PgSzKD82+OvJWIVRhNJ2c/g2at24NFgv2J4gHRCvRF510gy1ipKgbDTXCqqoG szqFpxFyTRZXhAepcov31SZRnHjdR5N2inwGMqudXogpiN3iq9V+VgHugplYzq4smNPF NTcfFGuABAZtfqD5ZqfUF6vvl5YeI93LAMpUs= Received: by 10.142.2.13 with SMTP id 13mr337208wfb.28.1271180948318; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:08 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.142.248.9 with SMTP id v9ls34448wfh.1.p; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.8.2 with SMTP id 2mr1040941wfh.15.1271180945798; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.8.2 with SMTP id 2mr1040938wfh.15.1271180945433; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vw0-f46.google.com (mail-vw0-f46.google.com [209.85.212.46]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 18si1171023pzk.14.2010.04.13.10.49.04; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:04 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.46 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.46; Received: by vws18 with SMTP id 18so1795946vws.19 for ; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.167.140 with HTTP; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <808704.84236.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <4BBE188B.8070807@lojban.org> <4BC02ABC.8000300@lojban.org> <4BC1D15A.5030409@lojban.org> <4BC36464.8010707@gmail.com> <4BC3B98F.5070805@gmail.com> <808704.84236.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2010 13:49:03 -0400 Received: by 10.220.4.23 with SMTP id 23mr3268224vcp.71.1271180943624; Tue, 13 Apr 2010 10:49:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] {le} in xorlo From: Luke Bergen To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.46 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/33d26e8385fed297 X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/2dac47461a4dd736 Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001517576f369709ce048421e0eb --001517576f369709ce048421e0eb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hey xorxes, since we're on this topic, could you answer a question about xorlo that I couldn't find on the "how to use xorlo" page? What does it mean if I say {ci lo re bakni cu citka lo pipno}? And would the meaning change if I used {le pipno} instead of {lo pipno} mi'e pafcribe On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 1:41 PM, John E Clifford wrote: > (pc will probably want to argue that there is an objective rock > > bottom, but let's stay away from that putative rock bottom for the > moment so that we have the two perspectives easily available.) > > Geez, Louise, do I really say stuff like that? Yes, I suppose I do (don't > bother citing the references). Of course, if we shift the frame we can get > down to something else -- not necessarily deeper, but different. In any > case this doesn't have a lot to do with 'le', whose specificity (or whatever > you want to call it) derives from its deictic character: the referent is > already picked out and then it gets a label attached. > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --001517576f369709ce048421e0eb Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey xorxes, since we're on this topic, could you answer a question abou= t xorlo that I couldn't find on the "how to use xorlo" page?<= div>
What does it mean if I say {ci lo re bakni cu citka lo p= ipno}? =A0And would the meaning change if I used {le pipno} instead of {lo = pipno}

=A0mi'e pafcribe

= On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 1:41 PM, John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com> wro= te:
(pc will probably want to= argue that there is an objective rock

bottom, but let's stay away from that putative rock bottom for the
moment so that we have the two perspectives easily available.)

Geez, Louise, do I really say stuff like that? =A0Yes, I suppose I do= (don't bother citing the references). =A0Of course, if we shift the fr= ame we can get down to something else -- not necessarily deeper, but differ= ent. =A0In any case this doesn't have a lot to do with 'le', wh= ose specificity (or whatever you want to call it) derives from its deictic = character: the referent is already picked out and then it gets a label atta= ched.





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