From lojban+bncCN673cmqFBDe3qDeBBoE98_lHA@googlegroups.com Fri Apr 16 02:35:50 2010 Received: from mail-yw0-f137.google.com ([209.85.211.137]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O2hxg-0006Vg-JA; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:50 -0700 Received: by ywh1 with SMTP id 1sf1284316ywh.28 for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:received:x-vr-score :x-authority-analysis:x-cm-score:message-id:date:from:organization :user-agent:x-accept-language:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=r2zBKb4kfg0ZZNfqlDiPNW7B45UBqPEeO43ebH3VJro=; b=6QhFzVTXYkAz8ww96QV71Tdlb+d1RuOEtt8O5kB6mRYMauOKdtlFrUAObwjurYSMzr Jd6Rs+MMIXSzjaKt99OzqHwFzCcM6RTMqTVK4rny61ZlGPxMw8OL35spqjhbNBoEF2q7 A/ADMjX3QIlkRvNkS+aLtOgoMfk1JdYAICk40= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-vr-score:x-authority-analysis:x-cm-score :message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:x-accept-language :mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=LNJC8JPwoZdUMSn5QCajIGYF/luSqkknSuJZY/MarlBGuYlqkfs3oMmAYjgBwrgy0Z BRkEhovxV8v9q7lZ7Zc1Q77xyY56VIifwbcs4yWgvl1UH28WtgXR19fRHaBxQ9jr4VYh RkWEQabgOAZCpor18IXxjX1e2r86dragxL0OY= Received: by 10.91.85.16 with SMTP id n16mr359655agl.32.1271410526542; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:26 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.91.67.25 with SMTP id u25ls1569903agk.7.p; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.41.36 with SMTP id o36mr582943ago.8.1271410524300; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.41.36 with SMTP id o36mr582942ago.8.1271410524269; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eastrmmtao101.cox.net (eastrmmtao101.cox.net [68.230.240.7]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 25si255804ywh.3.2010.04.16.02.35.24; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 68.230.240.7 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) client-ip=68.230.240.7; Received: from eastrmimpo03.cox.net ([68.1.16.126]) by eastrmmtao101.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.00.01.00 201-2244-105-20090324) with ESMTP id <20100416093521.OBD14747.eastrmmtao101.cox.net@eastrmimpo03.cox.net> for ; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 05:35:21 -0400 Received: from [192.168.0.100] ([70.187.225.124]) by eastrmimpo03.cox.net with bizsmtp id 69bJ1e0072hfrC6029bMjf; Fri, 16 Apr 2010 05:35:22 -0400 X-VR-Score: -100.00 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=garkv6WxUlWCZxlYffz6yNGlDVHTZyAXTUdcTJEJ4sc= c=1 sm=1 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=lsg66w07okjF3vGJL2g+Jw==:17 a=8YJikuA2AAAA:8 a=tzidIA9Rpm5xB3nVvpAA:9 a=AUajeS9MjZUhQ1wXQjeShbCPudYA:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=dxBpO5_FDU0A:10 a=lsg66w07okjF3vGJL2g+Jw==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: <4BC82F54.6060603@lojban.org> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 05:35:16 -0400 From: "Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG" Organization: The Logical Language Group, Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: {le} in xorlo References: <4BBE188B.8070807@lojban.org> <448505.50300.qm@web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <201585.79379.qm@web81303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <201004132253.05621.phma@phma.optus.nu> <4a02d723-a934-434a-b626-0a3a9fbf803f@u22g2000yqf.googlegroups.com> <4BC76B7F.2050000@lojban.org> <7e8430e5-b1c4-477f-92d2-18c49b8d561f@30g2000yqi.googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: <7e8430e5-b1c4-477f-92d2-18c49b8d561f@30g2000yqi.googlegroups.com> X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 68.230.240.7 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) smtp.mail=lojbab@lojban.org X-Original-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Lindar wrote: > Bob, you've done a bit of placing words in my mouth, as it were. My apologies, if I've misunderstood. As I've said, I've been sensitized for that sort of thing from losing so many people over the years. I'm > not scared of further change, but more so I'm annoyed by my inability > to follow discussions due to the technical language surrounding it and > by the fact that we've wasted so much damn time arguing about really > small semantics instead of just making a damn decision and trying it > out. The academics want to reason things out and get it right. Trying it out if it is logically imperfect is what they don't want. (And I'm sometimes not sure all of them really care about making decisions at all). > Also, I get what you mean about UI, but it seems like it's the > only thing anybody bothers to learn and I'm tired of having to filter > out 15-some characters that mean nothing to me, but clearly had a lot > of thought behind them. They may not have. Indeed, one would hope that eventually attitudinals wouldn't have much thought at all, but just come out. But UI words may be easier to learn than gismu and lujvo, and there are a more limited number - and most of all there is almost no grammar to get wrong. Others may be intimidated by the grammar as much as you are intimidated? by strings of UI cmavo. Of course the best solution is to learn them rather than filter them out, and accept being approximate in meaning because they weren't meant to be semantically precise. I suspect that there is a relatively small subset of the cmavo that comprise most of the ones used. lojbab -- Bob LeChevalier lojbab@lojban.org www.lojban.org President and Founder, The Logical Language Group, Inc. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. 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