From lojban+bncCJ2UzZHuDRDJ9LHeBBoE7o-9QA@googlegroups.com Mon Apr 19 08:44:39 2010 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O3t9D-0002bq-TU; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:39 -0700 Received: by vws20 with SMTP id 20sf1056792vws.16 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:date:received:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=f3/X7RbxlvB9WXeptO85hfLqjgfiA06l6XmDHwmTkNk=; b=It3TYE+tJwZOfcTiflxoxp5sd8MgNkbJWha4I2/PvWEmsGfR4VpHROvrZluU3z31dk oIqa1ZUXgyXBldpR2LfkuMQJTSUb0is/NE33wCnCC3Oh4nHiR2rVAvwteTw/48cx/g1P MNVjwKM8az6N7R/XOGdkZIDkTz3UcjSRzsMKs= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=v7Cz2oGIteNnsfxX7Obqcd3oNTJhPRGehVuPPdE3MTjexoAexBDMDCIUH++suGLGOn HPCvr6xY+n9Hwl7WtePFwwySegm8l2qoAlQDA2JbyVqh/Xt9MtZObmKTVS95Z9fu0xac G60+UQP829mThwbjhq4HIAaMo1uVE/46ClboM= Received: by 10.220.122.78 with SMTP id k14mr345287vcr.40.1271691849792; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:09 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.68.217 with SMTP id w25ls10584110vci.1.p; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.85.203 with SMTP id p11mr332687vcl.4.1271691848908; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.85.203 with SMTP id p11mr332686vcl.4.1271691848884; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qy0-f197.google.com (mail-qy0-f197.google.com [209.85.221.197]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id a10si3172988vci.4.2010.04.19.08.44.07; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:07 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.221.197 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.221.197; Received: by qyk35 with SMTP id 35so2145154qyk.11 for ; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.79.75 with HTTP; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:02 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <991859.82338.qm@web81301.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <4BBE188B.8070807@lojban.org> <4BC9056F.9040705@gmail.com> <618898.68218.qm@web81307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <381899.30620.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <851523.82178.qm@web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <991859.82338.qm@web81301.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2010 12:44:02 -0300 Received: by 10.229.26.135 with SMTP id e7mr5536815qcc.58.1271691842803; Mon, 19 Apr 2010 08:44:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] {le} in xorlo From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.221.197 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:23 AM, John E Clifford wr= ote: > WTF? 'su'o' is not a quantifier, only a cardinal? In "su'o lo su'o broda cu brode", the first "su'o" is a logical quantifier, the bridi operator: '(Ex ...) ... ', the second one is just a cardinality, the number of referents of the sumti "lo broda". So I can't say what "su'o" is in itself, only what it is used as in a given syntactic context. The same words that are used as logical quantifiers in Lojban are also used as cardinals. >=A0Okay, so we need a (rarely used) plural universal quantifier. =A0Do we = need an explicitly singular -- or plural -- particular quantifier? Not so o= bviously; I can't think off hand of a case where singularity or plurality w= as so important but not explicitly stated. I agree that taking "su'o" as a plural quantifier would not be all that harmful. Nowhere near as harmful as taking "ro" to be the plural universal quantifier, anyway. mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.