From lojban+bncCJ2UzZHuDRDjpqDfBBoELj1TKQ@googlegroups.com Mon May 10 07:09:00 2010 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OBTf7-0002z3-JT; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:09:00 -0700 Received: by vws12 with SMTP id 12sf1364674vws.16 for ; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=RStQk3YLBGSxGmobfJENTnfoa6IPd1d7dXS4EGgIzmw=; b=CzFRrRsz7DUACZyZR3DVJjUNOw0lfLMYSGCyE8/C7/3cKzT0FV8/satumYLzZaXr6S yxkgcncobi3bIICYSVql6bexCcsEn2hVOfV4HGqeL/X2B0IeHafpixkRCYTPAUwcQJ+p HEddUwg13Yy1QsoQysvMtYxLteuEHGxZH+Gs8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=lS6wpSFpNhI/rkxuMLgIMjt0y+ahrUozRjsgJIjVheVnfOOkoSitAyGK0BWuFNKhxU XbGYflJX1ANhFm1QgBLRH4130m5vPfv0sqyklpqOCpA3eM1imlyOQ1NND/7VRg/Bfc7C BYBxIGFteoYnKsXRxK0y5CxaScLZIVuVBT8Ck= Received: by 10.220.62.8 with SMTP id v8mr464346vch.50.1273500515281; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:35 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.46.194 with SMTP id k2ls9378640vcf.2.p; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.159.130 with SMTP id j2mr1305734vcx.14.1273500513557; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.159.130 with SMTP id j2mr1305733vcx.14.1273500513540; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vw0-f49.google.com (mail-vw0-f49.google.com [209.85.212.49]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id b14si7868665vcx.1.2010.05.10.07.08.32; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:32 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.49 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.49; Received: by vws18 with SMTP id 18so59954vws.22 for ; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.231.149 with SMTP id jq21mr3351528qcb.50.1273500512054; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.82.11 with HTTP; Mon, 10 May 2010 07:08:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 10 May 2010 11:08:31 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Attitudinal scales and the meaning of {cu'i} From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.49 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 10:04 AM, Daniel Brockman wrot= e: > > No, I don't think {.o'a cu'i} is a midpoint at all. =A0I think it's a > zero point. =A0To me, {cu'i} means zero. > > So {.o'a cu'i} simply means zero pride. "Zero pride" has negative connotations that ".o'a cu'i" doesn't have, and it's not quite the same as "modesty", but that may or may not be relevant to what you are saying. Are you saying that: (1) There shouldn't be an entry for ".o'a cu'i" in jbovlaste. (2) There shouldn't be a definition for ".o'a cu'i" in http://www.lojban.org/tiki/BPFK+Section:+Realis+Attitudinals (3) In the event that the LLG ever publishes a dictionary, that dictionary should not have an entry for ".o'a cu'i". As for (1), the way jbovlaste was designed it is not possible to have a natlang -> lojban result unless there is a lojban entry, so the only way that jbovlaste can return something for a search on "twice" is if it has an entry for "re roi". That may be a less than optimal design, but that's how it is. As for (2), I'm not convinced that the cu'i words are really transparently compositional. The wording "zero X" does not seem to capture their meaning in most cases, but that may be just a failure of the English idiom "zero X". "Zero patience" suggests impatience, not "o'o cu'i", "zero relaxation" suggests stress, not "o'u cu'i", and so on. As for (3), it's probably too early to decide anything one way or the other, but I suppose the obvious choice would be to follow whatever we do for (2). mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.