From lojban+bncCNTM-bHNDhD-39rfBBoEyzUNUQ@googlegroups.com Fri May 21 09:08:58 2010 Received: from mail-qy0-f156.google.com ([209.85.221.156]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OFUmD-0004cR-DM; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:08:57 -0700 Received: by qyk28 with SMTP id 28sf1276539qyk.26 for ; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:08:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received:received-spf:received:date:from:to:subject :in-reply-to:message-id:references:user-agent:mime-version :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-id; bh=Z8ZQO8QeoSxLrFSPx101tmFwa9Tz0UBO7IVO6rPOz8g=; b=otunmU1tYQ8VPTZiZXEev9HgiyYDd5Ov89FWjw3dixBl3vAHkWDhDRl9c+XcK0Hbbj KXtov1LiGNNBHm4UkQnIHvZv5BQKQ5Pvunhk0ntXAJG4omCLuyrNZsSH3kwWyNjt1mu/ hxCLaLici4iydmRPRt4yvIZ5fufWnlITr9y7c= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to :message-id:references:user-agent:mime-version :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-id; b=Cpcy6jdTVCzobRtiu+KJJqpO4Sy8oqhlItQ4RckQMnJHWWNYgdsNjHatKjCfMUs0OW aemf8b8YlakLxOAcmPpJWjcAueIo0E/Npmvoa0bzzY/32BEJU5M8vjC7xzlT1nEeH88N l2X8KIqzzJMY4yDkcwjGz7D/rZCMscF6oUGDg= Received: by 10.229.1.153 with SMTP id 25mr249350qcf.16.1274458110807; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:08:30 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.27.66 with SMTP id h2ls842731qcc.1.p; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:08:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.81.132 with SMTP id x4mr201114qak.3.1274458109513; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:08:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.150.251.13 with SMTP id y13mr823095ybh.29.1274457934899; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:05:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.150.251.13 with SMTP id y13mr823093ybh.29.1274457934875; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:05:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cec.wustl.edu (express.cec.wustl.edu [128.252.21.16]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id s42si3171609ybc.1.2010.05.21.09.05.31; Fri, 21 May 2010 09:05:31 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 128.252.21.16 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of adam@pubcrawler.org) client-ip=128.252.21.16; Received: from grid.cec.wustl.edu (grid.cec.wustl.edu [128.252.20.97]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mail.cec.wustl.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 903291E8070; Fri, 21 May 2010 11:05:31 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 21 May 2010 11:05:31 -0500 (CDT) From: "Adam D. Lopresto" To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Named multiples In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (LRH 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 128.252.21.16 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of adam@pubcrawler.org) smtp.mail=adam@pubcrawler.org X-Original-Sender: adam@pubcrawler.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1; FORMAT=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-ID: On Thu, 12 May 2010, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 10:48 PM, purpleposeidon > wrote: >> Xorxes, do you have a grammar containing all of your changes? I know >> that you've got a tense-simplification proposal on the Tiki. > > Most of them are listed here: > > http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=3Dzasni+gerna+cenba+vreji Interesting. Some of those are definitely good, some strike me as going wa= y too far (of course), some somewhere in between. But I'm curious about the last one, allowing relative clauses to attach to selbri. What exactly is t= he "obvious meaning" that they have? I mean, the common error is {ti gerku pe mi} ("This is my dog."), but I don't see how you can consistently get norma= l semantics, or even how to get the right meaning there (it's not the same as {ti pe mi gerku}). --=20 Adam Lopresto http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/ Good communication is as stimulating as black coffee, and just as hard to sleep after. --Anne Morrow Lindbergh --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.