From lojban+bncCOzcnrWBFBDyhYrgBBoElsZYIQ@googlegroups.com Sun May 30 08:23:54 2010 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OIkMY-0000nP-7t; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:54 -0700 Received: by vws15 with SMTP id 15sf320233vws.16 for ; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:sender :received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=xouoZ3fAr7GgYyNiSN2CJ6DgHRMzwQPOZTp+v8yzpBI=; b=IK4q9DkwaKdy2SgFUklACunv9S6/n/9zh65Xz8R2q+aRBKipR6CWuFLG+ZMYEFc+44 EEbWrm6D1BY8YzMcbpT3uXx8+p4iHPByrPt922A5Wu4oaFmLZOGYMr+8pXpQBiI4BE/9 YojlgVp+kGTSeDEbb9vWpLdjpnSigODdH4Rm0= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; b=QCfzNJrok0RIqTuckaMQjMMrJ7vxrl2Eq5vCo9ZMyqqiSU43PPa98ESwZS0SvZ2rrJ pD0wg+TaXHKXDagUNfO1+FmrBYLu9SikbXRV4p5mI4PEb1b93QsotfFBAAmRUUV/JeEf K8Ixi+bW/bHEWhHMXUsJRoFy5UszLgektlseM= Received: by 10.220.158.76 with SMTP id e12mr160484vcx.10.1275233010643; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:30 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.64.164 with SMTP id e36ls1659018vci.1.p; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.172.142 with SMTP id l14mr774373vcz.18.1275233009564; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.172.142 with SMTP id l14mr774372vcz.18.1275233009534; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vw0-f53.google.com (mail-vw0-f53.google.com [209.85.212.53]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id b14si3355933vcx.1.2010.05.30.08.23.28; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:28 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of pascal.akihiko@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.53 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.53; Received: by mail-vw0-f53.google.com with SMTP id 8so2420813vws.26 for ; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.96.214 with SMTP id i22mr1170049qan.133.1275233004344; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:24 -0700 (PDT) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.141.8 with HTTP; Sun, 30 May 2010 08:23:24 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <3414c7b0-2a75-4cb2-99a4-0afa6458f6ba@t34g2000prd.googlegroups.com> <7ac5ef76-747a-4077-ac8d-bd45e0c68005@y6g2000pra.googlegroups.com> <556832.6378.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <959500ee-ea4d-4acf-9353-f2c990ba25a7@t34g2000prd.googlegroups.com> Date: Sun, 30 May 2010 16:23:24 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Named multiples From: tijlan To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of pascal.akihiko@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.53 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=pascal.akihiko@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: pascal.akihiko@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00c09f93de0c3ad7560487d1522c --00c09f93de0c3ad7560487d1522c Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On 30 May 2010 07:22, Lindar wrote: > .spagetis. = x1 is spaghetti with sauce x2 > ?? > Generally I'm not very fond of being quick to stow places into a brivla that could otherwise be expressed with sumtcita or some other means. The fact that you and Daniel came up with different sumti for the x2 already shows the limitaion of this place's predictability. And the more we try to expand the place structure, the more we would risk to make the brivla's definition arbitrary and less neutral. "with" can be expressed with {joi}, {jo'u}, {jo'e}, {je}, etc., and "of type" with {le'a}, {kai}, {ra'i}, etc. I suggest we start with as minimal a place structure as possible for a new word and then let usage call for addition of places if any. The place structure should be convenient, not cumbersome. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --00c09f93de0c3ad7560487d1522c Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On 30 May 2010 07:22, Lindar &= lt;lindarthebard@yahoo.com&g= t; wrote:
.spagetis. =3D x1 is spaghetti with sauce x2
??

Generally I'm not v= ery fond of being quick to stow places into a brivla that could otherwise b= e expressed with sumtcita or some other means. The fact that you and Daniel= came up with different sumti for the x2 already shows the limitaion of thi= s place's predictability. And the more we try to expand the place struc= ture, the more we would risk to make the brivla's definition arbitrary = and less neutral.

"with" can be expressed with {joi}, {jo'u}, {jo'e}, {= je}, etc., and "of type" with {le'a}, {kai}, {ra'i}, etc.= I suggest we start with as minimal a place structure as possible for a new= word and then let usage call for addition of places if any. The place stru= cture should be convenient, not cumbersome.
=A0