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Date: Sat, 26 Jun 2010 15:05:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] Question about ki'ai
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Why isn't this a simple adverbial use of the word for "sudden" as it appear=
s to be?  There is in English a displacement for some kind of emphasis, but=
 that is handled differently in Lojban.  The other question is, what is mea=
nt here?  The sense seems to be "out of the blue, without an anticipatory e=
vent, unexpectedly" and so might be the kind of transition that could be su=
mmed up by a discursive (which are not very clearly defined), but the simpl=
e adverb needs to be discounted before going on in this way.  =20




________________________________
From: Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com>
To: "lojban@googlegroups.com" <lojban@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sat, June 26, 2010 3:17:33 PM
Subject: [lojban] Question about ki'ai


Can ki'ai be used to make a nonce evidential/discursive?
I wanted to do something like "suddenly, someone yelled".
So, I wanted a discursive for "suddenly" (I think this would be a situation=
 for a discursive of some kind anyway).
So for this could I do something like {ki'ai .ky suksa .ky da krixa}?
And if this could be confused for the attitude of the speaker instead of in=
dicating the mode of the bridi, could a new cmavo be coined.  Maybe somethi=
ng like:
ki'ei: convert the following brivla (or maybe it would be best to make the =
following word a cmevla/zoi quoted word?) into a nonce discursive/evidentia=
l.
We have cmavo for converting just about everything into anything else.  It =
seems odd to not have a way to convert stuff to discursive/evidential (whic=
h I'm discovering are really handy word classes)
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     =20

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<html><head><style type=3D"text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></he=
ad><body><div style=3D"font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;fon=
t-size:12pt"><div>Why isn't this a simple adverbial use of the word for "su=
dden" as it appears to be?&nbsp; There is in English a displacement for som=
e kind of emphasis, but that is handled differently in Lojban.&nbsp; The ot=
her question is, what is meant here?&nbsp; The sense seems to be "out of th=
e blue, without an anticipatory event, unexpectedly" and so might be the ki=
nd of transition that could be summed up by a discursive (which are not ver=
y clearly defined), but the simple adverb needs to be discounted before goi=
ng on in this way. &nbsp; <br></div><div style=3D"font-family: times new ro=
man,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><br><div style=3D"font-family: =
times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><font size=3D"2" fa=
ce=3D"Tahoma"><hr size=3D"1"><b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">From:</s=
pan></b>
 Luke Bergen &lt;lukeabergen@gmail.com&gt;<br><b><span style=3D"font-weight=
: bold;">To:</span></b> "lojban@googlegroups.com" &lt;lojban@googlegroups.c=
om&gt;<br><b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Sat, June =
26, 2010 3:17:33 PM<br><b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span=
></b> [lojban] Question about ki'ai<br></font><br>
<p>Can ki'ai be used to make a nonce evidential/discursive?</p>
<p>I wanted to do something like "suddenly, someone yelled".</p>
<p>So, I wanted a discursive for "suddenly" (I think this would be a situat=
ion for a discursive of some kind anyway).</p>
<p>So for this could I do something like {ki'ai .ky suksa .ky da krixa}?<br=
>
And if this could be confused for the attitude of the speaker instead of in=
dicating the mode of the bridi, could a new cmavo be coined.&nbsp; Maybe so=
mething like:<br>
ki'ei: convert the following brivla (or maybe it would be best to make the =
following word a cmevla/zoi quoted word?) into a nonce discursive/evidentia=
l.</p>
<p>We have cmavo for converting just about everything into anything else.&n=
bsp; It seems odd to not have a way to convert stuff to discursive/evidenti=
al (which I'm discovering are really handy word classes)</p>

<p></p>

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