From lojban+bncCNf8pM-bDBD8v9fhBBoEvx3kGg@googlegroups.com Thu Jul 08 07:26:23 2010 Received: from mail-yx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.213.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1OWs3M-0005LE-MP; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:26:23 -0700 Received: by yxj4 with SMTP id 4sf572168yxj.16 for ; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:26:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received :sender:received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from :to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=uDBEE9/1fa3g79uz2yG953EvHj0quRHdF4KZuoT6Z7I=; b=5MLgtWM+QTeBjTMz1bGiYKcJmDvZFrxVbMNHHIOjArw9rch4tHE0Bc8XuuJjmvvHQI sAadrQK12xpjp6+d2tsGPpcbxK+cqCjTpjW/O/kDqeiFpdaFGV/OfnU24Mh+O2vmGzvb PjclmRHC/vsWNhM8GfOVoSIk2CT6BDarMfM7w= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=3hqmeGwivD5Mw9KiwbADbRsz5rY5GyBykLgaj4iX0VHB8Da0+veeDBpyZ5fW6mTKZL kTXFKesYB95YGL2HpQ2lSvxRNXfVwO8N2U3l8GKjvjLUf4Dtu3OCsJv9gZA/exkvcvDw m9Jt2ZtIApMsIkl0GEAnsUGtgqG7elsAlTwMY= Received: by 10.101.179.22 with SMTP id g22mr850604anp.6.1278599164761; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:26:04 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.151.132.8 with SMTP id j8ls187770ybn.1.p; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:26:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.150.69.4 with SMTP id r4mr226342yba.21.1278599163818; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:26:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.129.83 with SMTP id n19mr523398wbs.14.1278598594473; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.129.83 with SMTP id n19mr523396wbs.14.1278598594441; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wy0-f174.google.com (mail-wy0-f174.google.com [74.125.82.174]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id u3si5947000wbb.7.2010.07.08.07.16.33; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:16:33 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of paskios@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.174 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.174; Received: by wyf23 with SMTP id 23so692501wyf.33 for ; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:16:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.227.129.18 with SMTP id m18mr6693543wbs.2.1278598593203; Thu, 08 Jul 2010 07:16:33 -0700 (PDT) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.216.86.211 with HTTP; Thu, 8 Jul 2010 07:16:33 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 8 Jul 2010 15:16:33 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] beyond good and evil From: tijlan To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: paskios@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of paskios@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.174 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=paskios@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001485f44caef558cc048ae0ee0d --001485f44caef558cc048ae0ee0d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On 8 July 2010 14:33, Luke Bergen wrote: > I just tried putting it into jboski and it says that the second lo is > misplaced. I thought {joi} and friends worked like {.e} does, not like {je} > does. Does {joi} make a tanru of some sort? > {joi} can be within a tanru, but a tanru is not what {joi} makes. I don't think the rule that turns two brivlas into a tanru has anything to do with the rule by which a JOI specifies the kind of connection between grammatical units. The pair of units a JOI is between, is self-evident, given that they must connect things that are on the same syntactic level (which is also the case for every natlang, so far as I hear): (a) lo [broda] joi [brode] (b) [lo broda] joi [lo brode] The first one cannot possibly be a connection between sumtis; and the second one not between brivlas. jboski does not parse these correctly, and that may be a bug (I could be wrong on that, though). What is not a bug is its inability to treat JA as JOI. The proposal (which I support) is that JOI and JA as well as A, BIhI, VUhU and JOhI be merged into just JOI. And this is one of the things jboski's official eye doesn't recognize. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --001485f44caef558cc048ae0ee0d Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On 8 July 2010 14:33, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com&= gt; wrote:
I just tried putting it into jboski and it says that the second = lo is misplaced. =A0I thought {joi} and friends worked like {.e} does, not = like {je} does. =A0Does {joi} make a tanru of some sort?

{joi} can be within a tanru, but a tanru is not what {joi} makes. = I don't think the rule that turns two brivlas into a tanru has anything= to do with the rule by which a JOI specifies the kind of connection betwee= n grammatical units. The pair of units a JOI is between, is self-evident, g= iven that they must connect things that are on the same syntactic level (wh= ich is also the case for every natlang, so far as I hear):

=A0(a) lo [broda] joi [brode]

=A0(b) [lo broda] joi [lo brode]
The first one cannot possibly be a connection between sumtis; and the= second one not between brivlas. jboski does not parse these correctly, and= that may be a bug (I could be wrong on that, though). What is not a bug is= its inability to treat JA as JOI. The proposal (which I support) is that J= OI and JA as well as A, BIhI, VUhU and JOhI be merged into just JOI. And th= is is one of the things jboski's official eye doesn't recognize.

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