From lojban+bncCPGMg4mHHBDCtbDjBBoEvTIXWw@googlegroups.com Wed Aug 18 10:39:43 2010 Received: from mail-qy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.216.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Olmbt-0004cy-8p; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:43 -0700 Received: by qyk12 with SMTP id 12sf483548qyk.16 for ; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=NByqB6DtpjKy5vG1mw4M2fAQxjVw7q/0i83i/3eTV6A=; b=RXAmclUrxESfZkRzrUh4yBKRtwUTi19/6Zc0eU09Hxl4hp2Dl/EfdGrpiZuiWhXsYN O7Jrbo/eO7Tms1TmdlSjA1PVldxpeEvt/UYeCBsIO/gHQC+VAmHXU5G695rEGhJTOCYh K1Tk/00OAL5lQg1IwLDxvzfT9K68E5Bq6o3sM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=UQ2B/LpjVOQ6wvFDkuVvsG1St89A1aro6R3sSXER3t2DxTYr6cZbEkzASCNHsma8dT k6ibXpJgoyeoHZmSxfWXiU2KnXvnDE/AdU5Iz+f19RJgtX7tpyPfiKPHNAAyN0gZLv9y 9eqWzr0d13EpkSG+CCS/PwdrFK2kpFVRqgWKA= Received: by 10.229.43.136 with SMTP id w8mr309400qce.45.1282153154903; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:14 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.207.84 with SMTP id fx20ls406312qcb.0.p; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.218.18 with SMTP id ho18mr830540qcb.11.1282153153980; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.218.18 with SMTP id ho18mr830539qcb.11.1282153153950; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vw0-f47.google.com (mail-vw0-f47.google.com [209.85.212.47]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id l26si289426qck.1.2010.08.18.10.39.12; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of ivo.doko@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.47 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.47; Received: by vws13 with SMTP id 13so805202vws.20 for ; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.49.204 with SMTP id w12mr5073953vcf.243.1282153152399; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.177.3 with HTTP; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 10:39:12 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 19:39:12 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Trilling/rolling R From: Ivo Doko To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: ivo.doko@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of ivo.doko@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.47 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=ivo.doko@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 18 August 2010 17:09, Luke Bergen wrote: > hmm, I guess that's kind of like what I do. =C2=A0I would describe it as = pushing > air through my mouth tapping the tip of my tongue against the middle-ish > section of the roof of my mouth. Yes, you're most probably doing it right. Another significant difference between alveolar flap and 't' is that if you want to produce the 't' sound by itself (for example if you want to say /t=C9=99/ or ty (in Lojban)), you "prepare your mouth" for it by making your tongue touch your upper teeth, then at the same time you push the air and separate your tongue from your teeth to produce the 't' sound. If you want to do the same with the alveolar flap (you want to say /=C9=BE=C9=99/ or ry (in Lojban)), you "prepare your mouth" for it by lower= ing your tongue, without it touching either your upper teeth or your palate, then as you start pushing the air your tongue instantly curls upward causing its top to separate from the bottom of your mouth and eventually hit the palate of your mouth, continuing its motion as if its collision with the palate caused it to bounce off of the palate (that's why it's called a "flap" after all), lowering until your tongue lies on the bottom of your mouth again but this time with its top curled upward as if you were going to say the English 'r'. This motion of the tip of your tongue is supposed to be almost half-circular, because its motion starts from right behind your lower teeth, it starts going up and back towards the middle-ish part of your palate, which it then hits, "bounces off" and continues its motion downward and backward for a little more. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.