From lojban+bncCJ2UzZHuDRDe_qjkBBoEQIqYYQ@googlegroups.com Fri Sep 10 07:23:43 2010 Received: from mail-ww0-f61.google.com ([74.125.82.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Ou4Vu-0004dJ-Tk; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:43 -0700 Received: by wwe15 with SMTP id 15sf523841wwe.16 for ; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=p2SvLtVP6guFEULgXn3aeT92i8eFQU4KLMyzwMxabdk=; b=KdiScCcDJOuQA/J01GQJbaVy2o983Qd8TdPq0bkJQTkfxiPwSmhIYFuMy0BcVN6qZF yxmm8AyN/KuG2RwMycyDY/H/fzmjeatkls6ijnwE0ELAjcH8Z0b1+sagrfdF25+6ap26 tcKYXWCiUTduID+D6GXduGb4eDedmn0SY0yuw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=e8WnrG+mNoWOoDUX2RZH39gYVJ82Iiy7bSIvbGBgkybxs5TsjiJRbSx5GInpyVbxnN sFcnHuebJZKcjfYTYxRe147t/OIdl1zT+pssjNBZoTVyoZ1YMSZ3De/q1QF4WTVQGEKL 1nuWire54ret07JfY+z70VzRPIqR6DcS0mBJ0= Received: by 10.216.144.194 with SMTP id n44mr103781wej.4.1284128606804; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:26 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.216.198.162 with SMTP id v34ls3408852wen.3.p; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.30.129 with SMTP id k1mr60943wea.6.1284128605862; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.30.129 with SMTP id k1mr60942wea.6.1284128605838; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ww0-f50.google.com (mail-ww0-f50.google.com [74.125.82.50]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id s70si891974weq.5.2010.09.10.07.23.24; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:24 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.50 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.50; Received: by wwb18 with SMTP id 18so3437644wwb.31 for ; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:24 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.227.72.139 with SMTP id m11mr98337wbj.30.1284128603932; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.151.203 with HTTP; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 07:23:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20100910011141.GS20652@digitalkingdom.org> Date: Fri, 10 Sep 2010 11:23:23 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Teaching methods, especially WRT terminators, and validation thereof From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.50 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 2:47 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > Now, I admit to not having an example bridi using all those > terminators, there may be terminators {cu} doesn't enable elision of I > missed, and some of those I listed may not be able to elid with {cu}. It is > an extreme example to show my point. It may be hard to come up with examples where you may need more than two different kinds of terminator, but it's easy to come up with examples where you may need to use one kind several times: lo pendo be lo bruna be lo speni be lo pendo be lo mamta be mi cu zvati ti Instead of "cu" you could use "be'o be'o be'o be'o be'o" or "ku ku ku ku ku" or some combination of them, but you can't use less than five. Not that anyone would actually understand what you meant anyway, but at least with "cu" it's trivial to be sure it's grammatical, whereas with terminators, you will have to spend some time figuring it out. That's an extreme case, but the principle is the same (if less extreme) even when you get down to a single terminator. The processing you need to do in your head is less with "cu" than with any terminator. (I personally exclude "toi", "li'u", and "te'u", which enclose full texts, from the category of elidable terminators. I never elide them, and I think it's bad to elide them even in the rare cases when they can be.) > .xorxes. is one of the most respected members of this community. I don't > think anyone would say his word is law, I sure hope not. I love it when I manage to persuade someone with my point of view, but I would hate to give orders or lay down the law. If someone does something just because I say so, not because they are convinced, I don't like it. > and most everyone has at least > privately disagreed with him on occasion, I don't think you need to hedge that with "most"... :) >what he says is well thought out, > usually makes a good deal of sense, and is agreeable to the majority if not > the entirety of those who listen to him. Thanks for the compliments! > Also, {xorlo}, the biggest contribution to Lojban since events before I > joined. It's named xorlo after the creator of the proposal. I'm not completely happy that xorlo is attributed to me so much. I think And Rosta had a lot to do with it, and many others participated in the discussions that led to that. The word "xorlo", if I'm not mistaken, was coined by pc as a pejorative. mu'o mi'e xorxes -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.