From lojban+bncCMHEmaCOBhDkk8rkBBoEwUa34g@googlegroups.com Thu Sep 16 14:19:52 2010 Received: from mail-gy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.160.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1OwLrs-0004eH-R0; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:52 -0700 Received: by gya1 with SMTP id 1sf1451625gya.16 for ; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=gG1Sbu9qj0OTEXnzWRh+PAxZPMZiXcqQ4pNvBf73ebM=; b=SwyMYp+F9HzScuG6nSSESK4ff5qS4afJAW6SYO1UK6R7QDFOs1OFwkWItig3ztT09/ OOuV2AMiDhKRIsmPVuE8TvuSCnJ6gQ0Rf2R5OxSBoK56zOs7mdZqIqUla8euXQTDQL7R e7kPCVyJZx+SbLX0KU/LApBEf6SbBZ8kQb+1E= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=n15h4peMDWVVArwRstJ+kjZvrpP0CjMiSvqb/A35BZwo8laV/itdiSTxKN9uRrnzFD aq3JzJ1O3s04W/5CEgIaScCAKwG6e2KBVTfmV3cBoR85WngFOBKpJ24VzbsOdZGFiAFu iB+tfLCpRzMUTp/yaOlCluctCE5Bawtsc36Do= Received: by 10.90.57.40 with SMTP id f40mr591695aga.34.1284671972039; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:32 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.150.145.1 with SMTP id s1ls505953ybd.1.p; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.98.10 with SMTP id a10mr947659ybm.52.1284671971022; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.98.10 with SMTP id a10mr947657ybm.52.1284671970756; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-f51.google.com (mail-yw0-f51.google.com [209.85.213.51]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id q2si2841473ybk.1.2010.09.16.14.19.29; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.213.51 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.213.51; Received: by ywg8 with SMTP id 8so748574ywg.10 for ; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.100.92.18 with SMTP id p18mr10156anb.132.1284671969355; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.207.84 with HTTP; Thu, 16 Sep 2010 14:19:29 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2010 15:19:29 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: [lojban] Re: Naming: Borrowed versus Native From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com, lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.213.51 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e645b7a862e9a70490670060 --0016e645b7a862e9a70490670060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 3:07 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > Reposted from a thread on the jbovlaste group: > > My entire argument regarding Lojban names for things is as follows: >> >> 1) Borrowing words from other languages (fu'ivla) is a Bad Thing ( >> http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/B/Bad-Thing.html) and should only be done >> when there is NO OTHER WAY. This means ANY language, including Latin. >> >> 2) Fluent jbopre are expected to be able to understand any gismu, cmavo, >> lujvo, etc. that they see without the need to consult a dictionary. >> >> 3) Specifically regarding creatures: Nearly every creature with a name has >> a *descriptive* common name, and all Linnean names of things are >> descriptive, in the Latin language. >> >> 4) As such, I see no reason why a descriptive cmene should not be >> preferable to a borrowed foreign cmene in *every* case. > > > I am hereby inviting discussion, critique, etc. regarding the above from > anyone who wishes to. Just to give an example of what I mean: la'o gy.Bald Eagle.gy zerle'a cipni lo blabi stedu .i zo zerle'a smuni zo'oi.Raptor. .i lo zerle'a cipni cu mintu lo kalte cipni .i la'o gy.Bald Eagle.gy cu mintu lo labystedu zerle'acpi Would you really rather use Linnaen name, *"Haliaeetus leucocephalus"?* -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --0016e645b7a862e9a70490670060 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 3:07 PM, Jonathan Jones = <eyeonus@gmail.co= m> wrote:
Reposted from a thread on the jbovlaste group:

My entire a= rgument regarding Lojban names for things is as follows:

1) Borrowing words from other languages (fu'ivla) is a Bad Thing (<= a href=3D"http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/B/Bad-Thing.html" target=3D"_blan= k">http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/B/Bad-Thing.html) and should only be= done when there is NO OTHER WAY. This means ANY language, including Latin.=

2) Fluent jbopre are expected to be able to understand any gismu, cmavo= , lujvo, etc. that they see without the need to consult a dictionary.
3) Specifically regarding creatures: Nearly every creature with a name ha= s a *descriptive* common name, and all Linnean names of things are descript= ive, in the Latin language.

4) As such, I see no reason why a descriptive cmene should not be prefe= rable to a borrowed foreign cmene in *every* case.

I = am hereby inviting discussion, critique, etc. regarding the above from anyo= ne who wishes to.

Just to give an example of what I mean:

la'o gy.Bald Ea= gle.gy zerle'a cipni lo blabi stedu

.i zo zerle'a smuni zo&#= 39;oi.Raptor.

.i lo zerle'a cipni cu mintu lo kalte cipni

.i la'o gy.Bald Eagle.gy cu mintu lo labystedu zerle'acpi
Would you really rather use Linnaen name, "Haliaeetus leucocephal= us"?


--
mu'o mi'e .ai= onys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu

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