From lojban+bncCNTPpI2KGxCUhOTkBBoExw17cg@googlegroups.com Tue Sep 21 12:06:23 2010 Received: from mail-pz0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Oy8AK-0004zb-Se; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:06:23 -0700 Received: by pzk7 with SMTP id 7sf648067pzk.16 for ; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:06:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:received:received:from:to:subject:date:user-agent :references:in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition; bh=H7uY7smYJxGyK5Z0PVDltFcnp/x5S0qSEDapXAAd7wY=; b=qIYjAZzKob7OFNsNtwye6jo01Y7y4giHipM2sAEA2nL9FD5mQWQtBgVHdOjmkknPv4 oUQc6z1ArP/WKJV5UJGHt64Wdp3bket65eUJMbW/BvQ1cfD7FcnRWq780kUwdzM8f9pY JXdo1qAE82JwOtwP4eKNWdmANSVOBJUUdS8/Q= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition; b=QdB25DX5oo0NxIKRhAUTe1leNuO8gBIbxwoeqJJ3RgNn4hmiLewmB+15+vOZ1w5ymb hZ6/cAHvUBGwVHfLzWWgjDwgQBD2XKFdhpB5iAMlXOJz5TobUlVnoErcm8POHSf5wLJN HEb18rOiXRXvEVi50pQSVZk9Zvs54TyRJw/AI= Received: by 10.115.66.26 with SMTP id t26mr879337wak.18.1285095956500; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:05:56 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.115.98.19 with SMTP id a19ls7496095wam.1.p; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.137.13 with SMTP id k13mr2168539wad.1.1285095954708; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.114.137.13 with SMTP id k13mr2168537wad.1.1285095954431; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.120]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id j18si11460939wan.1.2010.09.21.12.05.54; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.120 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.120; X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=88hQlV/VnhrPhhPadeRuWHBNMc0qRjlK2a7+9yZesI4= c=1 sm=0 a=3yAmS0hOBEsA:10 a=wPDyFdB5xvgA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:17 a=j80EzDrWYv0Md0HvWDsA:9 a=dMQZSTNInz0tMnMKlwYdVOdBDG8A:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 75.176.118.168 Received: from [75.176.118.168] ([75.176.118.168:40126] helo=chausie) by cdptpa-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 8A/CA-29299-012099C4; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 19:05:53 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C9CA27D1 for ; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 15:05:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] ma krinu lonu lo jbopre na tavla fo la.lojban. ne'i levi snustu | Why aren't we speaking in Lojban in here? Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2010 15:05:48 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201009211505.50100.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.120 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline On Tuesday 21 September 2010 11:57:57 Michael Turniansky wrote: > I use constructions like "setese" for three reasons -- 1) when I'm > translating and trying to mimic the word order of the velfanva 2) When > I'm trying to emphasize one sumti over another (it's paradigmatic that > earlier sumti places seem to be perceived as "more important" than > later ones), and/or 3) If I have a complex sumti, I'd rather throw it > at the end of the sentence rather than have to put a whole bunch of > terminators so that you can "pop up" a half dozen levels and have to > remember "what was the main selbri again? Oh, yeah..." before getting > to the next sumti. That's a lot of processing power to ask of a human > listener/reader. (I tend to write lojban like I speak English -- with > lots of subrodinate cruft) I'd do all this with combinations of SE and FA. When I would use "setese" is when I'm joining two selbri with a conjunction and the place structures don't match, so argument 2 of one selbri is argument 3 of the other, and vice versa. Pierre -- li fi'u vu'u fi'u fi'u du li pa -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.