From lojban+bncCL-Ey5qiChCAivTkBBoEGpMNkw@googlegroups.com Fri Sep 24 13:07:43 2010 Received: from mail-gw0-f61.google.com ([74.125.83.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1OzEYW-0000Ha-CV; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:43 -0700 Received: by gwb11 with SMTP id 11sf1781877gwb.16 for ; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:sender :received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=1Ni4ccWtANTt42KlG/QgTQTTQ6gdlQxbUrZEGCdZUJI=; b=Is9NzR/KWOTDfcacQjKhDle3jE3iF0/chaD1Ab4EfW0heo4f1cLGTz59PZuimv0RsY wfrChl+xKcmF5n7CWEwSsEoytyoMA61UchcWs+/rkl7OdiaMTNrWS3TXzcQtpPU0XImX q4G7j0HMDug9OMgEC9Ao06Zfx245lGLP6uCqg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=i7//n2CgzAYv9TMq71jcEDckLMUI8aa+UnvH4uTJcN02Pg9t5WseAmLOpIzSs+KCcM Jcsf1vspc76DH073/PSLvLCljM/mpgf8w0/lQdwEirwVLDbnlyY2U74Vezr1TUIZEIVn DTqQbjwUOhIBQNequDhajpAM4+8vfHN5MQT9A= Received: by 10.91.35.13 with SMTP id n13mr534080agj.55.1285358848658; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:28 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.91.215.10 with SMTP id s10ls1369722agq.5.p; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.45.2 with SMTP id x2mr1001490ybj.36.1285358848113; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.45.2 with SMTP id x2mr1001488ybj.36.1285358848080; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gy0-f176.google.com (mail-gy0-f176.google.com [209.85.160.176]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id a6si1881203ybo.14.2010.09.24.13.07.27; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:27 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of craigbdaniel@gmail.com designates 209.85.160.176 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.160.176; Received: by mail-gy0-f176.google.com with SMTP id 13so1631265gyb.35 for ; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.126.201 with SMTP id d9mr1279651vcs.103.1285358846832; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:26 -0700 (PDT) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.92.193 with HTTP; Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:07:26 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <726959.354.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <38be6f52-9655-414a-adbe-8eb94559fd5f@e34g2000prn.googlegroups.com> <20100923101847.c398dcec.kfa@gmx.net> <8b9a0138-57ef-4e4c-a343-653b4f481e8d@g10g2000vbc.googlegroups.com> <726959.354.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 24 Sep 2010 16:07:26 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Alice - the xorlo version From: Craig Daniel To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: craigbdaniel@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of craigbdaniel@gmail.com designates 209.85.160.176 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=craigbdaniel@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 3:46 PM, John E Clifford wro= te: > Well, there is no sign that Dodo is bored, etc., just that he is moving t= he > story along. =A0And do be very careful with UI to be sure that you don't = use them > to describe an emotion rather than express it. =A0Alice does not express = anything > (orally, at least) in this passage and there is o sign that the writer > empathizes with the emotion she is described as having.. I regard empathetically emoting in fiction (where of course you don't have strong feelings on people you're making up) as a reasonable way to say something about the tone of the story as it must seem to the people in it. That is, your empathetic emotion is as fictitious as the events. That said, I do agree with you that in this particular case there's no good case to be made for such commentary. I sorta left the text behind in that post and meandered into the realm of "so how would we talk about this" rather than "how should this specific text that talks about it be translated," and failed to make the transition clear (probably because it may not have been entirely clear in my head); I'm not suggesting that a string of empathetic attitudinals is the correct way to translate this text, merely that it would be a valid way to comment on a character who seems to be growing tired of sitting there doing nothing. - mi'e .kreig.daniyl. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.