From lojban+bncCMqBsa7nERDd-YHlBBoEIpQwsQ@googlegroups.com Mon Sep 27 04:15:57 2010 Received: from mail-qy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.216.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1P0BgX-0008Pv-Qm; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:57 -0700 Received: by qyk12 with SMTP id 12sf8646606qyk.16 for ; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=THhrCaATf4WjSij5coUCR979JFsOPK9V4fUqWD/5k7k=; b=qCZ9/J6wobVoyVy+JiFptF/VwGKNmpIAvRGeIpxPGYtiFxQqEArAQI5tSlx8+waGeE Uebwhs9w/I8dAkFEt5OISFsfxKj8o8jp7tFUcnG5HWeCLdDRZqtQp56q6CosImfSrmeW 3N3uab7049ABivHGLhX0gL1vcDYZHk4FGVIu4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=BsCkFf/32Fv9DMGvHCKLJI0Eq2r696AxtLE6wHJhe4hJv/a0khAFG6NszZLv9sGrt3 OcfITWvfO5Eg7wLGPFdAAunBMOtdVF9FKzKmI39rpVfg7sPuUl5uDTlFQRW+Q1oHfzIo IAxGEHVrePIzlpPrEACuH2tU0iBVOHZzx9NAk= Received: by 10.220.84.133 with SMTP id j5mr125479vcl.44.1285586141598; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:41 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.160.2 with SMTP id l2ls456171vcx.4.p; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.62.31 with SMTP id p31mr2274552ybk.9.1285586140360; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.151.62.31 with SMTP id p31mr2274549ybk.9.1285586140322; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gx0-f171.google.com (mail-gx0-f171.google.com [209.85.161.171]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id q26si5262472ybk.10.2010.09.27.04.15.39; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of oges007@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.171 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.161.171; Received: by mail-gx0-f171.google.com with SMTP id 6so1762326gxk.30 for ; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.191.17 with SMTP id o17mr8794767ybf.180.1285586138974; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.30.195 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 04:15:38 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 21:15:38 +1000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] la za'e filjvocedra (The Age of Easy Lujvo) From: Ross Ogilvie To: lojban X-Original-Sender: oges007@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of oges007@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.171 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=oges007@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd6b28e244ebc04913bd988 --000e0cd6b28e244ebc04913bd988 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 hehehe doi ro do poi jundi zoi gy. arrested development gy. lu mi blagau vo'a li'u se cusku la .tobias.funkes. mi'e .ros. On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 4:00 PM, Stela Selckiku wrote: > On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Luke Bergen > wrote: > > It's an exellent point. I only start thinking about lujvo creaton > > when I'm trying to think of how to translate an english word. > > But that seems like such a waste. If that's the only reason that > > we use for making lujvo then we're going to just fill the ze'a > > jvoca'u with glico translations. > > .ie tcetce malglico > > .i .i'e do jvofi'i zo jvoca'u noi mlejvo > > The thing is that it's much harder to make a word for something > completely new. You have to explain to people what the concept is, > instead of just pointing them at which existing concept to connect the > word to. For instance I made up a lujvo the other day za'e "la'ucni" > (lalxu+cinmo, lake+emote), by which I mean experiencing the feeling of > encountering a new space that's very broad and deep, a large range of > possibilities that you can dive into and explore. But more concrete I > guess than za'e "xasycni" (xamsi+cinmo, ocean+emote) which would be > completely overwhelming, would be something there's no way you could > ever explore it to its ends and depth. With "la'ucni" it's a feeling > of something that's vast but also comprehensible, something you can > see the ends of even if it would take a long time to explore them. So > you can see how it's hard to be sure even with all those words of > explanation that you're thinking of the same thing I am, since I'm not > just hooking it onto a concept we already share. > > I think that filjvo can help us to more easily explore new parts of > the jvoca'u, because then even if there isn't a natlang word that the > filjvo resembles you can expect its meaning because of the pattern of > similar words. For instance many of the -gau lujvo were obviously > made as translations of English words, like badgau = defend and dadgau > = to hang/suspend, but you can make a new one like, oh I dunno, za'e > "blagau" (blanu+gasnu, blue+do) and even though there isn't a specific > English word for making something blue, the meaning of the filjvo is > easy to follow because it's in the same pattern as the rest of the > -gau words, so you know what I'm talking about if I say "mi blagau le > zdani" (I made the house blue). > > mi'e la stela selckiku > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --000e0cd6b28e244ebc04913bd988 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
hehehe
d= oi ro do poi jundi zoi gy. arrested development gy.
lu mi blagau vo'a li'u se cusku la .tobias.funkes.

mi'e = .ros.

On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 4:00 PM, St= ela Selckiku <se= lckiku@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's an exellent point.=A0 I only start thinking about lujvo creat= on
> when I'm trying to think of how to translate an english word.
> But that seems like such a waste.=A0 If that's the only reason tha= t
> we use for making lujvo then we're going to just fill the ze'a=
> jvoca'u with glico translations.

.ie tcetce malglico

.i .i'e do jvofi'i zo jvoca'u noi mlejvo

The thing is that it's much harder to make a word for something
completely new. =A0You have to explain to people what the concept is,
instead of just pointing them at which existing concept to connect the
word to. =A0For instance I made up a lujvo the other day za'e "la&= #39;ucni"
(lalxu+cinmo, lake+emote), by which I mean experiencing the feeling of
encountering a new space that's very broad and deep, a large range of possibilities that you can dive into and explore. =A0But more concrete I guess than za'e "xasycni" (xamsi+cinmo, ocean+emote) which wo= uld be
completely overwhelming, would be something there's no way you could ever explore it to its ends and depth. =A0With "la'ucni" it&#= 39;s a feeling
of something that's vast but also comprehensible, something you can
see the ends of even if it would take a long time to explore them. =A0So you can see how it's hard to be sure even with all those words of
explanation that you're thinking of the same thing I am, since I'm = not
just hooking it onto a concept we already share.

I think that filjvo can help us to more easily explore new parts of
the jvoca'u, because then even if there isn't a natlang word that t= he
filjvo resembles you can expect its meaning because of the pattern of
similar words. =A0For instance many of the -gau lujvo were obviously
made as translations of English words, like badgau =3D defend and dadgau =3D to hang/suspend, but you can make a new one like, oh I dunno, za'e<= br> "blagau" (blanu+gasnu, blue+do) and even though there isn't a= specific
English word for making something blue, the meaning of the filjvo is
easy to follow because it's in the same pattern as the rest of the
-gau words, so you know what I'm talking about if I say "mi blagau= le
zdani" (I made the house blue).

mi'e la stela selckiku

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.


--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
--000e0cd6b28e244ebc04913bd988--