From lojban+bncCIGHwM2rDhDesoPlBBoESpCXfw@googlegroups.com Mon Sep 27 10:50:41 2010 Received: from mail-wy0-f189.google.com ([74.125.82.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1P0HqX-0003ad-AG; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:41 -0700 Received: by wyb40 with SMTP id 40sf1369410wyb.16 for ; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:received:received:date:from:to :subject:message-id:mail-followup-to:references:mime-version :in-reply-to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; bh=sg6A6VZfVUnMxTUHOLlctdCp2+weYwSIt5GIKsTpUUk=; b=bBwU+gjsp5eJxtaM3mM3h+UZOWm5rVvPemUFoE5FnphXt9MYmHseXJnyH/XYik/Jwd RvdggZk7ka/K9USGvRZ15kJm1hn5bTuEoVykD8O7AR1VWh0qql5HcpTa89nBcEdgI+tV gVKv/4Pynemv45K45XTWU624NCb3CHRp/cidI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; b=GCcNwa93ZMXXzhNnVwvNAe2KCME4vpOJNEh8WOUvg8zQeYo0rZwBYLJJuZLJqpL8gM QKob5ZRwNEsOZpjm2BQzPYjLo/+dyRBF/gxnmsAkC9mgdg0LH0ZY1lZoYWXjbwc0L7H9 gK0qP9bLAVBr4i/Dccr01RRftjAoGOTa6pIdc= Received: by 10.216.145.167 with SMTP id p39mr1302972wej.25.1285609822170; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:22 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.213.41.69 with SMTP id n5ls624508ebe.2.p; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.213.108.203 with SMTP id g11mr2249991ebp.10.1285609820254; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.213.108.203 with SMTP id g11mr2249990ebp.10.1285609820229; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ey0-f179.google.com (mail-ey0-f179.google.com [209.85.215.179]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id b5si6431609eei.0.2010.09.27.10.50.20; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.85.215.179 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) client-ip=209.85.215.179; Received: by eye27 with SMTP id 27so1502446eye.38 for ; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.213.28.196 with SMTP id n4mr6343850ebc.48.1285609819888; Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sunflowerriver.org (173-10-243-253-Albuquerque.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [173.10.243.253]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id u2sm1565175vcr.8.2010.09.27.10.50.17 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 27 Sep 2010 10:50:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 11:50:15 -0600 From: Alan Post To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] nu pa moi se nunkei la'e lu lo do ckiku ma zvati li'u lu'u Message-ID: <20100927175015.GD25976@alice.local> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20100925023935.GA18705@alice.local> <201009271901.55338.jezuch@interia.pl> <20100927171800.GB25976@alice.local> <201009271938.58364.jezuch@interia.pl> Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201009271938.58364.jezuch@interia.pl> X-Original-Sender: alanpost@sunflowerriver.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 209.85.215.179 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) smtp.mail=alanpost@sunflowerriver.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 07:38:57PM +0200, Krzysztof Sobolewski wrote: > Dnia poniedzia=B3ek, 27 wrze=B6nia 2010 o 19:18:18 Alan Post napisa=B3(a)= : > > The one of these you are interested in is here: > >=20 > > http://dag.github.com/cll/18/11/ >=20 > Ah indeed, ki'e. >=20 > > I personally think it could use a bit of fleshing out, it glosses > > over a lot very fast. >=20 > Yeah, no wonder I didn't remember it... >=20 > "It is perfectly possible to use non-numerical sumti after "me" and befor= e a member of MOI, producing strange results indeed:" >=20 > Is it "perfectly possible" because there's no way to prevent it with gram= mar itself, i.e. it's a bug that became a feature? ;) Because I still don't= have an idea what {me mi moi} would mean (me-th?). You can compose the meaning by looking at the definition of me and moi: me: x1 is a mass formed from the set x2 of n members, one or more of which is/are x3 moi: x1 is the (n)th member of set x2 when ordered by rule x3 [by standard x4] So one could take {me mi moi} to be: x1 is a member of the mass of those things that are mine. =20 I've been thinking about it like giving a name/description to a set, rather than counting the element of a set number-wise. Other intrepretation is most certainly welcome! It doesn't seem accidental= , as a special rule was made for it. -Alan --=20 .i ko djuno fi le do sevzi --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.