From lojban+bncCPT9voDQFhDExYvlBBoElW4sww@googlegroups.com Tue Sep 28 23:55:16 2010 Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1P0qZN-0000cJ-7f; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:55:15 -0700 Received: by gxk9 with SMTP id 9sf637521gxk.16 for ; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:55:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:mime-version :received:received:date:x-ip:user-agent:x-http-useragent:message-id :subject:from:to:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=kPQNTHvxFSg105v6dZK3sye7CnDaI0MHs3a+hdbnxKI=; b=o7CPI/MwgGHEpdOpTvO7Sf23n9xD7IPf9SdG2UM2Uu+56wQO3Fev/vlbD0jfizAohL kjZPEwc9dIZVYNPS53Ao2HyuOzEoMMml8iG49Q9QGrO8t4pLWZ0OeKNz+EGM+YgepKMT thrmUxCBRyjXDgGY2czG3Y2zbveLGXq51tdzc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:mime-version:date:x-ip:user-agent:x-http-useragent :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence :mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=0lmkGI/2dtZ1HHxZ7WDPoabbv+d1U0FjfmC+g9PmdA81pCg3qZYa4HWJOw2XCSHbOW kXdEExd0Kf3OhsnfQa+x4YW5UW2hTC6pm1OS8/LTguvNas8s5fFkiKMPakLtkgt1GIB/ VDwBKdaK8b2wQubCUv/KY4H+3FryGgGpdSaPk= Received: by 10.101.141.11 with SMTP id t11mr76430ann.19.1285743300780; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:55:00 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.101.131.11 with SMTP id i11ls160298ann.5.p; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:55:00 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.101.141.14 with SMTP id t14mr74821ann.13.1285743299960; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: by w19g2000yqb.googlegroups.com with HTTP; Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:54:59 -0700 (PDT) X-IP: 89.174.127.153 User-Agent: G2/1.0 X-HTTP-UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:2.0b7pre) Gecko/20100923 Firefox-4.0/4.0b7pre Ubuntu/10.04,gzip(gfe) Message-ID: <3fb41468-d367-4724-97da-df8ca4fe7187@w19g2000yqb.googlegroups.com> Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=5Blojban=5D_Spelling_of_the_name_of_the_Lojban_in_Polis?= =?UTF-8?Q?h_=28matter_of_=27Lojban=27_or_=27Lo=C5=BCban=27=29?= From: Marek Rogalski To: lojban X-Original-Sender: mafikpl@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This question is adressed mainly to people who (more or less) speak polish. I have been translating some stuff on tiki a few minutes ago and encountered a problem which many of you could happen to find: what spelling of word 'Lojban' should we use in Polish? Since in the word 'Lojban' there is a sound represented by a letter '=C5=BC' in Polish, spelling 'Lo=C5=BCban' would seem perfect for a phoneti= c translation (which i think is better for a spoken language). Further problem arise when we try to place new word somewhere in a sentence. It needs proper flexical parts to be understood correctly. We end up with declination of word 'Lo=C5=BCban': M Lo=C5=BCban D Lo=C5=BCnanu C Lo=C5=BCbanowi B Lo=C5=BCban N (z) Lo=C5=BCbanem M (o) Lo=C5=BCbanie W Lo=C5=BCbanie! Using this method (first polonizing letters and then declinating the word according to polish grammar) we can speak and write about lojban words (mainly 'Lojban' name) in Polish. There is also other approach which is widely used (first of all on polish 'Lojban' wiki page). In this approach we speak the same way as in the previous. The only difference is writing word 'Lojban' as 'Lojban' which, by native polish speakers is read rather as 'Loyban'. When we use this method we also have to declinate the word: M Lojban D Lojnanu C Lojbanowi B Lojban N (z) Lojbanem M (o) Lojbanie W Lojbanie! I have personally met three people who encountered Lojban before, and (in most of the cases ;) ) their reading of the word sounded like 'loyban'. Writing about Lojban needs consistence in its name (read or written). What do you think should be official spelling of the Lojban name in Polish? -- Marek Rogalski --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.