From lojban+bncCOjSjrXVGBDq7ZjlBBoExqCx-A@googlegroups.com Fri Oct 01 12:31:11 2010 Received: from mail-yw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.213.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1P1lJu-0004Aw-Px; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:31:11 -0700 Received: by ywo32 with SMTP id 32sf21659ywo.16 for ; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=xkT7ixT6rno8T9Xrtbt/4oALB21VlqUfzNpbfJmnPnE=; b=0WMIOm3TOnD0zuNrHnlX+9cnIxPg7iL9qpL9fooQeWBv4OyzQO+P3Je0RN+7W0Y40H HCl2TnCAOoEjA3R+yvmECHJKbO5r/jSWNGp4eDLWqYaV+7goxQCtEewL2M6gGkQc4tqH 8tKM9UMovfCZuLB8qgKCUsxA4RPZmmmgF1R/I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=DisT+0wuwaLntZnzM5Jz0836YYNF6f7iwhj4wfXOVXua7nx+6VoHlz6x7a4CsqCyp2 J0gzNykOtdG7CcTAcmNRxgQpJakFWUIxms9TmlRj6M8Cp0l0hnJTQsnb06S00a6TruGv 9Q6jeKzgazf8W7FIH/t1r1S/+ksDhfoHlPnY8= Received: by 10.90.121.13 with SMTP id t13mr401803agc.26.1285961451011; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:51 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.125.77 with SMTP id x13ls1596551ibr.1.p; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.161.69 with SMTP id q5mr1371581ibx.8.1285961450443; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.161.69 with SMTP id q5mr1371579ibx.8.1285961450406; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iw0-f181.google.com (mail-iw0-f181.google.com [209.85.214.181]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id e25si931896ibk.3.2010.10.01.12.30.49; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:49 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.181; Received: by mail-iw0-f181.google.com with SMTP id 39so5694997iwn.40 for ; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:49 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.14.5 with SMTP id e5mr6104974iba.175.1285961449186; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:30:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.48.79 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Oct 2010 12:30:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2010 15:30:49 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] la za'e filjvocedra (The Age of Easy Lujvo) From: Luke Bergen To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0003255762de5fc7df0491933bef --0003255762de5fc7df0491933bef Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sorry, I made a mess of that message. Maybe nelci was not a good choice for me to make an example with. Also, yes, I'm always confusing tanru and lujvo. Sorry about that. > And "zmanei" does not mean "ko'a zmadu lo ka ce'u > nelci ko'e", so it's not an example of the kind of -zma/-mau we were > talking about. I didn't think it did. I assume it means {ko'e zmadu ko'i lo ka ko'a nelci ce'u}. my two cents (and I'm probably glico biased)... I like e.g. {tcebarda}. I think it seems right that if I want to say "tom is very stupid when it come= s to girls" I can say {la tam cu tcebebna tu'a lo ninmu}. If I break this lujvo apart into a tanru it still makes sense given the bridi tail. If it were {la tam cu bebnytce tu'a lo ninmu} then breaking it up into a tanru would yield {la tam cu bebna be tu'a lo ninmu be'o mutce}. It seems like making the {tce} a suffix wouldn't be useful in most cases for adding more sumti places. 2010/10/1 Jorge Llamb=EDas > On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 4:04 PM, Luke Bergen wrote= : > > sorry to break into English but my lojban isn't good enough yet. > > If I'm understanding the conversation correctly, the discussion betwee= n > you > > and selkik is whether it should be tcebroda or brodytce. > > Right, for a lujvo with the meaning "ko'a mutce lo ka ce'u broda ko'e ko'= i > ...". > > > Should a similar > > question be asked about rai, nel/nei, mle, etc... > > For traji, and zmadu, yes, I brought them up because they are similar. > If by "mle" you mean "mli" (milxe), then yes, I think they should > follow the same pattern, and my argument was that nobody proposes > using zmadu or traji (in the intended sense) as prefixes. > > I'm not sure what nel/nei is doing here since it's a completely > different thing. And "zmanei" does not mean "ko'a zmadu lo ka ce'u > nelci ko'e", so it's not an example of the kind of -zma/-mau we were > talking about. > > > It seems like there are > > many tanru that I could see going either way. Is that a beautiful > type-of > > tree or is that beautiful in a tree kind of way? > > You are now talking about tanru, yes? > > > Am I superlative type-of > > fond of... or am I a fond kind of superlative about...? > > What are either of those supposed to mean? That you are the person > that mosts likes something, or that some thing is the thing you like > the most? > > > I think that the CLL talks about tanru/lujvo being reflexive vs not. > > Do you mean symmetric? Reflexive is something else. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --0003255762de5fc7df0491933bef Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sorry, I made a mess of that message.

Maybe nelci was no= t a good choice for me to make an example with. =A0Also, yes, I'm alway= s confusing tanru and lujvo. =A0Sorry about that.

= > And "zmanei" does not mean "ko'= ;a zmadu lo ka ce'u
> nelci ko'e", so it's not an example of the kind of -zma/-= mau we were
> talking about.

I didn&#= 39;t think it did. =A0I assume it means {ko'e zmadu ko'i lo ka ko&#= 39;a nelci ce'u}.

my two cents (and I'm probably glico biased)... I l= ike e.g. {tcebarda}. =A0I think it seems right that if I want to say "= tom is very stupid when it comes to girls" I can say {la tam cu tcebeb= na tu'a lo ninmu}. =A0If I break this lujvo apart into a tanru it still= makes sense given the bridi tail. =A0If it were {la tam cu bebnytce tu'= ;a lo ninmu} then breaking it up into a tanru would yield {la tam cu bebna = be tu'a lo ninmu be'o mutce}. =A0It seems like making the {tce} a s= uffix wouldn't be useful in most cases for adding more sumti places.

2010/10/1 Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com&= gt;
On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 4:04 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
> sorry to break into=A0English=A0but my lojban isn't good enough ye= t.
> If I'm understanding the conversation correctly, the =A0discussion= between you
> and selkik is whether it should be tcebroda or brodytce.

Right, for a lujvo with the meaning "ko'a mutce lo ka ce'= ;u broda ko'e ko'i ...".

>=A0Should a similar
> question be asked about rai, nel/nei, mle, etc...

For traji, and zmadu, yes, I brought them up because they are similar= .
If by "mle" you mean "mli" (milxe), then yes, I think t= hey should
follow the same pattern, and my argument was that nobody proposes
using zmadu or traji (in the intended sense) as prefixes.

I'm not sure what nel/nei is doing here since it's a completely
different thing. And "zmanei" does not mean "ko'a zmadu = lo ka ce'u
nelci ko'e", so it's not an example of the kind of -zma/-mau w= e were
talking about.

>=A0It seems like there are
> many tanru that I could see going either way. =A0Is that a beautiful t= ype-of
> tree or is that beautiful in a tree kind of way?

You are now talking about tanru, yes?

>=A0Am I superlative type-of
> fond of... or am I a fond kind of superlative about...?

What are either of those supposed to mean? That you are the person that mosts likes something, or that some thing is the thing you like
the most?

> I think that the CLL talks about tanru/lujvo being reflexive vs not.
Do you mean symmetric? Reflexive is something else.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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