From lojban+bncCJ2UzZHuDRCb66fmBBoEcTnDtw@googlegroups.com Thu Oct 28 15:14:02 2010 Received: from mail-wy0-f189.google.com ([74.125.82.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PBajO-0007aj-Kt; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:14:02 -0700 Received: by wyb38 with SMTP id 38sf1373817wyb.16 for ; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=nedrdouA3r+uciJ3t9n/JJn1Ish215vFA1ATBsO+ts4=; b=qpYtjCAVOCJSNFNEHWAAz5onLi47NGeq809bJXhNEd6ug4UxcSXnbmPfkQF8ug6CGb 5+MbEkYgfYCjT1W2X12XLzzsGLphWd6ZmGvkTGaRPiwnSc5tbA0Np+pyqn/Pj+JHYRMb nXe8M9O1qAT5IMBh1MAec2WMl9wn6vKPCRFcg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=28rwJNi1lniTNy2k1CJ73w2D0TtPKn5mYx5wvsFC9fk/wJEdTy2DO7j6g9d+ogb/+y Dw/4U14MxRxekNoZIJhXmZoeSkL8F0oeh2Z5O8D1CCaAaBbKrs6WxS75qoqznPmT0N2Q 93/1jN00mX7Vc1L8ePgW1YfOf5xsfHjPJNnRA= Received: by 10.216.237.73 with SMTP id x51mr1730958weq.4.1288304027316; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:47 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.227.198.213 with SMTP id ep21ls870282wbb.2.p; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.142.206 with SMTP id r14mr549581wbu.9.1288304025262; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.142.206 with SMTP id r14mr549580wbu.9.1288304025233; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ww0-f46.google.com (mail-ww0-f46.google.com [74.125.82.46]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id q27si630584wbv.5.2010.10.28.15.13.44; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:44 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.46 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.46; Received: by wwd20 with SMTP id 20so2728207wwd.15 for ; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.227.127.210 with SMTP id h18mr3499413wbs.139.1288304023929; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.227.32.140 with HTTP; Thu, 28 Oct 2010 15:13:43 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2010 19:13:43 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Counterfactual Conditions From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.46 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Greg Nisbet wrote: > I was skimming wikipedia while doing an econ problem set and came > across this thing. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterfactual_conditional > > "1.If Oswald did not shoot Kennedy, then someone else did. > 2.If Oswald had not shot Kennedy, then someone else would have." > > (1) is an indicative conditional > (2) is a counterfactual conditional > > How does one encode each of those in Lojban? I can't figure it out. The indicative conditional is the ordinary logical connective "ganai ... gi ...", so: ganai la ozuyld na pu celcatra la kenedis gi lo drata be .obu cu ja'a go'i In Lojban this is transparently equivalent to: ga la ozuyld pu celcatra la kenedis gi lo drata be .obu cu go'i "Either Oswald shot Kennedy or someone else did." The counterfactual is a bit trickier. One way is: va'o lo nu da'i la ozuyld na pu catra la kenedis kei lo drata be .obu cu ja'a co'e "Under the hypothetical conditions that Oswald had not shot Kennedy, someone else would have." mu'o mi'e xorxes -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.