From lojban+bncCIycn8S8DhCF6rfmBBoEphoGzg@googlegroups.com Sun Oct 31 16:00:37 2010 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PCgt6-0001FG-5d; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:37 -0700 Received: by vws14 with SMTP id 14sf6304956vws.16 for ; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=3AGiERhJzphgVrjlxYynGb8Ban+VOcviyX22mexKaQg=; b=iwAy4OtZ96sB5xggAJmEMJEeENdZgIBBPgTxXHFYPHz3hJkOI8MMlJE4h9buHSMcoJ fAzUO8dXEm2H8TYPu/SKScVpnUSTZxYvUJMj5pWW1zfCBBLU3vyfRUB0Aud5aUzCYDtj MJjeg2sEebdXo217yivZdH0zGmu7g18qPp4zY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=2VRP8aV1T8MyhmuhOCe9XDCGT2hNA3mLz+s5VjJXVaZECYfRO13HrESQK7qHm3b4/L uxkWuPSVBKM3VFwqePAgRzf6xEufgDyfV1V1Cmgc0GkneTSgCEG7b0iC5ARB9OaoqooO Bck7RgOA1ru/FnXuPVmhiyVfpSvKxiykN2w8M= Received: by 10.220.186.69 with SMTP id cr5mr151987vcb.50.1288566021606; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:21 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.160.2 with SMTP id l2ls769113vcx.4.p; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.181.131 with SMTP id by3mr480809vcb.10.1288566020686; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.181.131 with SMTP id by3mr480808vcb.10.1288566020665; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id n18si800703vbs.3.2010.10.31.16.00.19; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:19 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.44 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.44; Received: by mail-vw0-f44.google.com with SMTP id 3so3061967vws.17 for ; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.89.11 with SMTP id c11mr7624454qam.207.1288566019381; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.219.14 with HTTP; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 16:00:19 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <201010291737.49946.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2010 19:00:19 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: "to pretend" or "to fake" From: Michael Turniansky To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: mturniansky@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of mturniansky@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.44 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=mturniansky@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 2010/10/31 Jorge Llamb=EDas : > On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Michael Turniansky > wrote: =A0(I've also always wanted an inverse of >> nu/ka, i.e. a way to grab a bridi back from an abstraction, so we can >> say things like "I like going to the movies in the afternoon, but >> Mikey likes to in the morning" without jumping through hoops ((calling >> my idea x'ua for a second) "mi nelci lo nu viska lo skina ca lo >> lecydo'i .iku'i la maikis nelci lo nu xu'a lo se go'i ca lo cerni") >> Sure, we could use the vague "co'e" but it's ...vague. > > But what if the "abstraction" was at the next level down: > > =A0mi mutce lo ka nelci lo nu viska lo skina ca lo lecydo'i .i ku'i la > maikis cu nelci lo nu ??? ca lo cerni > > The problem with back counting pro-things is that they don't work. > ??? -> xu'a ra in this case. (or xu'a rixivo (or is is rixici? I was never very clear if the convention was "ri"=3D"rixipa" or "ri"=3D"rixino")) The major problem is there is nothing in GOhA (as I understand it) that refers to sub-bridis, only main bridis (except for the special case of no'a). But we can refer to any (non prosumti) sumti we want, no matter how far down it is, since ri/ra/ru and abu/by/cy "see" all levels at once. So since we can do that, I'm just looking for a abstraction undoer... --gejyspa --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.