From lojban+bncCL-Ey5qiChDg6tzmBBoEXQ-NiA@googlegroups.com Sun Nov 07 15:25:33 2010 Received: from mail-gw0-f61.google.com ([74.125.83.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PFEc6-0007I7-FU; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:33 -0800 Received: by gwj20 with SMTP id 20sf5859894gwj.16 for ; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=98sVNB6D4TkWyLxwksm4XhSzIFaTiY2qh83gJTEUCYM=; b=PxFVkaPRdhKZ/CrbEFyzRXqGtIbaKW23nDWAMWKdWYdMtghqcjjg+esA3t5dD0oR8q c2v4FHQ/ocoxQ9PXEAxDG5fYwWDU7MfOdrEkBncdwRsUeHJKpVRAbgKnTF2qeJSeB41C djVX4KE/NUlTvJhApnm3SM7NZ0KXUu9jhaM6Y= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=jIVApUG98KX3pLW+ZuYmVCq/HNHHrMCBy1+oMj4vHpMD0r/GQW9qQ+tgOzypUqYDP7 v0yCmjUAcUYX9tJVRv1tXCwmmBEg35wZMmTxk6pyGiAfj4St8bCUiSdbBFPcWb+592nt UCoN0BlvGH8ukuj13umaBIs610hFbp22/jw68= Received: by 10.100.239.5 with SMTP id m5mr70414anh.28.1289172320109; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:20 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.180.73 with SMTP id bt9ls2937457ibb.0.p; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.39.129 with SMTP id g1mr945354ibe.17.1289172319289; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.39.129 with SMTP id g1mr945353ibe.17.1289172319260; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iw0-f170.google.com (mail-iw0-f170.google.com [209.85.214.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id bm7si2734801ibb.2.2010.11.07.15.25.18; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:18 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of craigbdaniel@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.170; Received: by mail-iw0-f170.google.com with SMTP id 5so7163643iwn.15 for ; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:18 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.42.228.5 with SMTP id jc5mr3375529icb.424.1289172318087; Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:25:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.178.137 with HTTP; Sun, 7 Nov 2010 15:25:18 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <125742.76624.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <8CD4CBEEE65C88A-1370-16D83@webmail-d003.sysops.aol.com> <6c90cb58-397f-48c7-a6d9-dc0d4d6f3a62@i4g2000pro.googlegroups.com> <201011072135.50151.jezuch@interia.pl> <9e09941a-d4e0-4695-b283-1bd1333b972f@35g2000prt.googlegroups.com> <125742.76624.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2010 18:25:18 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: I wanted to share this with you (writing thingy!). From: Craig Daniel To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: craigbdaniel@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of craigbdaniel@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=craigbdaniel@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:20 PM, John E Clifford wrot= e: > And the point of all this is...? =A0Creating new alphabets is an interest= ing > part of language creation and give flight to the more aesthetically > inclined. =A0It is thus welcomed and applauded. =A0But the suggestion tha= t we > actually use this (or any other clever alphabet) for Lojban inevitably > brings on the point of practicality. =A0It is hard enough to learn Lojban= as > it is, in a familiar -- if =A0slightly modified -- alphabet, bbut to add > learning a new alphabet, however clever, may well be the straw, etc. (see= , > as a not very atypical example, my years of not learning Hebrew, not to > mention Chinese). =A0The fact that the letter ""all look the same" just a= dds > to the problem in this case (cf Hebrew again and Armenian and Thai to sta= rt > the list). While the claim is not literally true, it is perceptually true > enough to amount to a serious problem. > But it sure looks nice. Creating new and inventive ways to write Lojban that each internally preserve desirable lojbanic qualities, with no expectation that they will ever catch on, and creating beautiful things with them is a hobby nearly as old as the language itself. Seriously, the CLL mentions Cyrillic (an actually practical one, for jbopre in Slavic countries) and Tengwar. This sort of thing is in a very real sense the most popular artistic tradition of the Lojban community. So, the point is joy. And art, without which no community can thrive. It is entirely useless, but it is fun and beautiful and that's good enough for me. (And it reminds me that I need to get around to digitizing some of my own Roman-alphabet Lojban calligraphy.) mi'e .kreig.daniyl. noi zu stidi su'o ve pensniste ku ku'i na stidi .ai le du'u plixau --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.