From lojban+bncCNTPpI2KGxDyw_vmBBoET7xNPA@googlegroups.com Sat Nov 13 11:07:43 2010 Received: from mail-px0-f189.google.com ([209.85.212.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PHLRr-0000nu-6H; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:43 -0800 Received: by pxi19 with SMTP id 19sf1592050pxi.16 for ; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:received:received:from:to:subject:date:user-agent :references:in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :content-disposition; bh=BRfLO5ansaX2qHX0M6mn/2HWYRnnZA206jTdtv/CREY=; b=Y/n5PkKNB4Sx1XHWl6pw2F5EPHCSbyguClmy34yV80qL1K8WbgAHkYUIg4wBRnjdec s6hXflflGm6fpIYP1gMusH4UfIQzgFFgha8efuwDNi88mKK9kicEHeEZ+KNeh4wPghl0 Bi7uJKWA0Y4Vi7qMi49uxq3tn/0k4U5xC7duQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :content-disposition; b=amcBjvXXrqN/KkqE7bY1GsZZp8LBX6kl8A5hSVrVsxVebmZN+92AqqlxYDzx0qTa/x 85phdgsPSl9bInXxX4fnMOEt4YbqtJjb0+LGDFY0yYe7iP8KAiQ8/Q1oIr12rpsdtWkc nI4LSv6h6pygy/K7n1fgtltTlIT7JQj3cQQ5M= Received: by 10.143.153.7 with SMTP id f7mr214969wfo.20.1289675250244; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:30 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.142.2.41 with SMTP id 41ls5828651wfb.0.p; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.217.18 with SMTP id p18mr2224054wfg.31.1289675249376; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.217.18 with SMTP id p18mr2224051wfg.31.1289675249347; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.121]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id f13si7667045wfo.0.2010.11.13.11.07.29; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:07:29 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.121 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.121; X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=pepdxKapwHuwCZNFD5uob2wvham6E+RljB0uXw08FdQ= c=1 sm=0 a=asGvSr2KmfgA:10 a=wPDyFdB5xvgA:10 a=Q9fys5e9bTEA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:17 a=Oo0YovaRSRUQ7moJj2oA:9 a=UpIWHCLDjVFETgCc-qgFDCfAvm4A:4 a=PUjeQqilurYA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 75.176.118.168 Received: from [75.176.118.168] ([75.176.118.168:52047] helo=chausie) by cdptpa-oedge03.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 01/1F-19545-0F1EEDC4; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 19:07:28 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id C38222D89 for ; Sat, 13 Nov 2010 14:07:27 -0500 (EST) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: x1 to the left Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2010 15:07:22 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201011131407.25152.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.121 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Saturday 13 November 2010 10:28:29 Ian Johnson wrote: > If you're using place structure, you're inevitably going to "discriminate= " > against some word order that is standard in some natlang. After all, ther= e > are 6 different ones: SVO, SOV, VSO, VOS, OVS, OSV. Lojban without FA or = SE > is SVO. Lojban can do SVO and SOV equally well. Unlike natlangs, however, it doesn'= t=20 have a small number of places for arguments that are usually assigned to=20 subject, direct object, and indirect object; rather, it has an indefinite= =20 sequence of places. x3 of dunda corresponds to the indirect object, but the= re=20 is no way x3 of mlafi'e (the side that has two eyes) could be called an=20 indirect object. Pierre --=20 When a barnacle settles down, its brain disintegrates. J=E1 n=E3o percebe nada, j=E1 n=E3o percebe nada. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.