From lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRCIxcbnBBoEaXl2mw@googlegroups.com Sat Nov 27 16:30:13 2010
Received: from mail-gy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.160.189])
	by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72)
	(envelope-from <lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRCIxcbnBBoEaXl2mw@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1PMV9d-0002pv-V8; Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:30:13 -0800
Received: by gyb11 with SMTP id 11sf2727751gyb.16
        for <multiple recipients>; Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:30:04 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received
         :received:received-spf:received:message-id:x-ymail-osg:received
         :x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version
         :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to
         :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive
         :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type;
        bh=VBc2j2qQMW1yohU7N0Ymz0LmPMHLrP7j7dCBiOmI8Co=;
        b=fzorW6iMIkMnMHhOsJ/pKmGJ18I0Dlr1eXYcIS/uqCbcqxBKfhkqu00/kvbbnNULrL
         GkmL8EUhvm7FC7qKpoHZRkcTg2be6Ot9TUjo+fRD69IFzHO3dUvt27fjYpmp6UviDOs2
         99FHwdBVnPc3+4nJ0U3BBIrLqq5oFaCeuqKlQ=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=x-beenthere:received-spf:message-id:x-ymail-osg:x-mailer:references
         :date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe
         :list-unsubscribe:content-type;
        b=0nfRsLnaitmNfK0b2GC3eH4GPgkCpCOEC/U6Z4lGQntSeffEqeBTO6m8hEpSIe7mIu
         YdF+EVGEaXFdSB8GPjwYDwFXEzd+OV7g3K12PXk5yS0gE3gzOkToy92pjuQoOGXKO2K9
         0GLzyRRbwIcnfaDcjzV/gEQ0+S5kf3wEI9czE=
Received: by 10.151.116.16 with SMTP id t16mr493987ybm.40.1290904200129;
        Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:30:00 -0800 (PST)
X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.151.127.39 with SMTP id e39ls2079247ybn.2.p; Sat, 27 Nov 2010
 16:29:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.151.6.16 with SMTP id j16mr1204173ybi.29.1290904199316;
        Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:29:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.151.6.16 with SMTP id j16mr1204171ybi.29.1290904199284;
        Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:29:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: from web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.124])
        by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id w9si605507ybe.1.2010.11.27.16.29.58;
        Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:29:58 -0800 (PST)
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 68.142.199.124 as permitted sender) client-ip=68.142.199.124;
Received: (qmail 37137 invoked by uid 60001); 28 Nov 2010 00:29:57 -0000
Message-ID: <678437.36904.qm@web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
X-YMail-OSG: F.oX05sVM1moOiz5qmzQaPb.JGA1Waa2.LSqEBuC97JyzvE
 FCu7Dbk.LrO36BHMGAm3moiJYN9LefDeKWGbL6DDg0yylKjDfLEIgGzQx4d_
 03GF1O_OXNizwcwnZ0Ah4xjFcEG3ULYVrodEWd.bPHNqTQRX4k2.fEjxpXL_
 o8a0oXQTxw7QdThguwWf_Bj_floOHde8wTeG5hugeB.krfaeFmb4tneZMxi.
 U3BAx.6.o92N0ZIJIw0IMm_M47MxbuOOhUE8zH3wgNos1reXWYGSUcv0UWuM
 WIvJfNWVGt5JB6UI2xg9jXPGw40iQu6HeooKu3UnpQ8OmId1WTn.QxgHExX5
 zMuQfHI2WwIUf9y6.hs0FF_LIpdbQYA6ZJWPnzp5Fc9acyx1V05ODa55N
Received: from [99.92.110.13] by web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:29:57 PST
X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/553 YahooMailWebService/0.8.107.285259
References: <AANLkTi=t2++Mx1Gt9RZKLcuSv=hj_v+7cND1HoQZ35O=@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTi=5Sp-Ttt3zW=WhovW+ZDAVz_yrX8_E_JZAObD_@mail.gmail.com> <492732.93430.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <AANLkTikwVipP2=fE9+pjNOpwBv2HvmxoPcS3e4ZCovWD@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTimhmSWrwLmMp7u61R_7AJf8jxbKkf=v43o1NW8y@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTikCfC2x8F3twVX6Xn1tNRGzoaM=E4odSUOOP+DW@mail.gmail.com> <696303.3339.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <AANLkTimgMDZ=-ouk5JKTRqSEGBuGJd_dwjdJua63nJjN@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTi=8osZ5CimZ-EjLTf+3yELJkjYMzH5Ypf7_gpBz@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTik4UoBw7_B87vQakr6N9URzxX-6j+j1nA8F=HRr@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTi=98AXPBLSYnk1XfVnpmNBp9jGyfQbbWyQ2WjDB@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTimB9RYuoWdZn3kH6bta4bJMBFT5hsahfm05abeE@mail.gmail.com> <593757.57433.qm@web81301.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <AANLkTi=BJefDxEWsA+EfXoqbCRjCFSXh0Fb7m5M=scQP@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTi=8GrVt9ne7CQm9HDjY407qVfk1XFG96ERdV8Ok@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTim4yt3s0=8XhPGue6BhEA=nRH0M7SO4SFt36oHS@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTinMToqbXYZum7ky8im1gqR3GBbg_3npSxc2j=rS@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTim3PqwKZZBvfUv1sb0WrK_Q=zdjXZgFf+SDMYco@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTimq0gi4KdA2qQ4K9PkEf7843hQbj3DEmGVOU-X-@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTik-y6U1dWHUX06fwrBOZRwdB0yd2hmrGN83KkKs@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTikbO4yLMr=NUOcUJyE7Rhzc5VMnaZbHmjOxxTzf@mail.gmail.com> <853082.89324.qm@web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <AANLkTimCg=JrHchE0PXGx3EqRGZzc9r9DtOroiHG+G-z@mail.gmail.com> <60366.49337.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <AANLkTinPLJfemz7xaS_JCfhXO-JEreoXWOc=kC5-4TYY@mail.gmail.com> <AANLkTi=icVkR1h8qTO39CYdwTXg_NjtO7PTC1Y2w3GD-@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2010 16:29:57 -0800 (PST)
From: John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=icVkR1h8qTO39CYdwTXg_NjtO7PTC1Y2w3GD-@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Original-Sender: kali9putra@yahoo.com
X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com:
 best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates
 68.142.199.124 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=kali9putra@yahoo.com; dkim=pass
 (test mode) header.i=@yahoo.com
Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban.googlegroups.com>
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/subscribe?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-924922954-1290904197=:36904"

--0-924922954-1290904197=:36904
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Well, perhaps good luck to you using it inside a program, since violation of 
type tend to lead to chaos (if you're very lucky).  If I only wanted to describe 
my emotions, what you write would be quite alright.  But, chances are, I have 
some emotions in this situation that I want to express and then  -- in English 
or Lojban -- I would probably put in some words that express them.  Your last 
sentence is, in fact, one such expression (it can also be used as a report and 
this is what makes English so messy and is the source of the muck-up in Lojban, 
like Loglan before it). 






________________________________
From: Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, November 27, 2010 6:05:49 PM
Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation


Good luck using lojban outside of a computer program, john.
"I see that you have injured yourself.  I imagine that you must feel extreme 
pain.  You have my sympothy selrirni"
On Nov 27, 2010 7:00 PM, "John E Clifford" <kali9putra@yahoo.com> wrote:

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at 
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.



      

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.


--0-924922954-1290904197=:36904
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><style type=3D"text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></he=
ad><body><div style=3D"font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;fon=
t-size:12pt">Well, perhaps good luck to you using it inside a program, sinc=
e violation of type tend to lead to chaos (if you're very lucky).&nbsp; If =
I only wanted to describe my emotions, what you write would be quite alrigh=
t.&nbsp; But, chances are, I have some emotions in this situation that I wa=
nt to express and then&nbsp; -- in English or Lojban -- I would probably pu=
t in some words that express them.&nbsp; Your last sentence is, in fact, on=
e such expression (it can also be used as a report and this is what makes E=
nglish so messy and is the source of the muck-up in Lojban, like Loglan bef=
ore it). <br><div><br></div><div style=3D"font-family: times new roman,new =
york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><br><div style=3D"font-family: times ne=
w roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><font size=3D"2"
 face=3D"Tahoma"><hr size=3D"1"><b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">From:=
</span></b> Luke Bergen &lt;lukeabergen@gmail.com&gt;<br><b><span style=3D"=
font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> lojban@googlegroups.com<br><b><span styl=
e=3D"font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Sat, November 27, 2010 6:05:49 PM=
<br><b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [lojban] =
Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation<br></font><br>
<p>Good luck using lojban outside of a computer program, john.</p>
<p>"I see that you have injured yourself.&nbsp; I imagine that you must fee=
l extreme pain.&nbsp; You have my sympothy selrirni"</p>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Nov 27, 2010 7:00 PM, "John E Clifford" &lt;<=
a rel=3D"nofollow" ymailto=3D"mailto:kali9putra@yahoo.com" target=3D"_blank=
" href=3D"mailto:kali9putra@yahoo.com">kali9putra@yahoo.com</a>&gt; wrote:<=
br></div>

<p></p>

-- <br>
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
lojban" group.<br>
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.<br>
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou=
ps.com.<br><span>

For more options, visit this group at <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://g=
roups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den">http://groups.google.com/group/lojba=
n?hl=3Den</a>.</span><br>


</div></div>
<!-- cg14.c201.mail.mud.yahoo.com compressed/chunked Fri Nov 26 17:17:38 UT=
C 2010 -->
<input id=3D"gwProxy" type=3D"hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick=3D"=
if(typeof(jsCall)=3D=3D'function'){jsCall();}else{setTimeout('jsCall()',500=
);}" id=3D"jsProxy" type=3D"hidden"><div id=3D"refHTML"></div></div><br>

      </body></html>

<p></p>

-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
lojban" group.<br />
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.<br />
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou=
ps.com.<br />

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban=
?hl=3Den.<br />



--0-924922954-1290904197=:36904--