From lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRD4n8nnBBoEaeFmew@googlegroups.com Sun Nov 28 04:50:13 2010 Received: from mail-gy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.160.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PMghl-0006QQ-HX; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:50:13 -0800 Received: by gyb11 with SMTP id 11sf3085888gyb.16 for ; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:50:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:message-id:x-ymail-osg:received :x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Us+W4TcrZ5Mx8AUqJocfB+41ufMq7aBdU0IHioOKh5s=; b=cTXzm6RZmRS7Vo8N1A/YGM37HFQZVo5H5LiiWgGc9ZfFQzG3NR2xF06z+Q//4/ZImG 2lOtXWWvQZWgRgF4eVgwU5FqSypuNUfqinp4NELqmRUi8+CBRMTYde67X9us0ex02Szq NnhXGdvsqJKWzDWDKVIRu+AcRWUUQq3g5fXN8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:message-id:x-ymail-osg:x-mailer:references :date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=Y/ZGqB52AuGu3pW0e0GHrL0qWhmJb8praLJ2hhGuQS3+lWXo0aZ2Ot4GBgVAPpRiaD 1kQtJ1h9anokzN/QegNMX//dM5DLa+NOgOP4Fc3df0hb3c5PSPqyL09QLpeJh0+5Ktph ww2Q5J2BJ3NJOWx92VCvErJxh9+0hFK20E9Bg= Received: by 10.90.42.19 with SMTP id p19mr354343agp.4.1290948600397; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:50:00 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.151.133.8 with SMTP id k8ls2895876ybn.4.p; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.146.17 with SMTP id t17mr1246408ybd.58.1290948599065; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.146.17 with SMTP id t17mr1246407ybd.58.1290948599028; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.124]) by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id w3si666008ybe.13.2010.11.28.04.49.57; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:58 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 68.142.199.124 as permitted sender) client-ip=68.142.199.124; Received: (qmail 47197 invoked by uid 60001); 28 Nov 2010 12:49:57 -0000 Message-ID: <361998.43098.qm@web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: QGjZtPMVM1nBz7KKueb_2Y4w18ckB2nqrYKd5Lygaw0QoKr MVTSSpe_0ZlYyL4jybannI26F2noGfSBIjlEUcetz9eu0rEpgBXWuo5qyYQy FlkKiOIGmXWhhnwGW2eqdGbpZKREGmY3Wr1JlI1uiastipzkCPz0av3ReWoI iEdDIPeKRezWmiYwGLIsa1H9uBUa2nB_OlPEB3HXA7MDvPnKo7prKsQXQldl ZAwQpqFQWTbTbHp4gm13793KoIZjnrDPMsV55f2O722Wqjbba_MtzU1rnp9V G9sF8rRB5_Hk7Z2qb7xG5rEMUWtDh5rJeegP5Xa.hkYVBa8kLYO68CiGRP.R Bid5A.WwReR6uy3M.iE_5LkPIDfM46hMIa6ysohledY2q0C1m2bRaaBZIIg- - Received: from [99.92.110.13] by web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:56 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/553 YahooMailWebService/0.8.107.285259 References: <659354.26852.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 04:49:56 -0800 (PST) From: John E Clifford Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation To: lojban@googlegroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: kali9putra@yahoo.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 68.142.199.124 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=kali9putra@yahoo.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@yahoo.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Exactly, and the latter two are linguistic but of very different linguistic= =20 types. ----- Original Message ---- From: Jorge Llamb=EDas To: lojban@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, November 28, 2010 6:33:10 AM Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 1:58 AM, Luke Bergen wrote: > So long as empathy doesn't require that I feel the actual emotion myself, > I'm fine with that. I don't want to say .oidai and accidentally imply th= at > I .oi When you use ".oi" as a verb like that is when you send pc into a fit. Neither saying ".oi" nor saying ".oidai" require that you feel anything. People seem terribly confused sometimes about the difference between feeling X, expressing X and claiming that they feel X. They are three different things. mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups= =20 "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to=20 lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at=20 http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. =20 --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.