Drat! (I am faking displeasure and frustration) I thought= the ear surgery would let me get by unnoticed.

From: Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com>
= To: lojban@googlegroups.co= m
Sent: Wed, December 1= , 2010 9:24:18 PM
Subject:<= /b> Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation

Yeah, there it is again. "But it's not a bridi so it's not logical". = I'd swear we had spock on our list or something. .u'i zo'o

On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 10:21 PM, John E Clifford <kali9putra@yaho= o.com> wrote:

Well, since I no longer believe that UI is primarily for expressing (etc= .) emotions (etc.), but about indicating spectra. I have only the log= ical problem -- shouldn't these be bridi? -- with 'dai' (which = I never did have a problem with as empathetic emotion, only wondering why i= t was restricted to second person) or even 'da'ai' in its full unemotional = form (assuming 'dai' can be extended to cover third party cases).

From: Jonathan Jones <<= a rel=3D"nofollow" ymailto=3D"mailto:eyeonus@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank" h= ref=3D"mailto:eyeonus@gmail.com">eyeonus@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com<= br>
Sent: Wed, Decemb= er 1, 2010 7:59:54 PM

Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-= .ui conversation

On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Craig Daniel <craigbdaniel= @gmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 8:54 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2010= at 6:32 PM, Craig Daniel <c= raigbdaniel@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 7:31 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
>>= > On Tue, Nov 30, 2010 at 6:01 PM, John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Why not, giv= en that it is built on 'ie'?
>> >> Gee, I hope someone can d= o better than xorxes.
>> >
>> >
>> > Be= cause of the bloody definition of the bloody word {pei}.
>> >
>> > UIdai is used to indicate another's UI-state= , why do you have such a
>> > problem
>> > with UIp= ei, which is used to ask about it?
>>
>> UIdai is *not* u= sed to indicate another's UI-state, but the speaker's
>> UI-state and the fact that it is empathetic in nature.
>
= > empathetic
>
> Showing empathy for /others/, and recognizi= ng their feelings etc
>
> empathy (uncountable)
>
> the intellectual identification of the thoughts, feelings, or state of=
> /another person/

Yes, but .uidai represents empatheti= c happiness - a mood on the part
of the speaker which arises from identi= fying with someone else's
happiness.

I can conceivably imagine this being something other than= happiness -
for instance, I can imagine expressing schadenfreude with "= .ui.oidai"
- but it would certainly be unusual. Dai, however, is still a= bout the
speaker's emotional state; in this, it differs from pei, which very
defi= nitely is not.

I'll give you that. {da'ai} is the truly non-speaker one, but I'm on t= he side of the fence against that one.

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.
=
.i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi pat= fu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegro= ups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegro= ups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.googl= e.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.