From lojban+bncCOjSjrXVGBD4jPfnBBoE-YfSig@googlegroups.com Mon Dec 06 21:30:46 2010 Received: from mail-gy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.160.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PPq8Q-0001G1-B1; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:46 -0800 Received: by gyb11 with SMTP id 11sf11282981gyb.16 for ; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=95eU6mScWzlzgK+VhOwjH1rLDlqtEL12qinBp04bxtA=; b=oBKmLxxwcGxR/l3xOvxBNdBMnIoisUTBGpWrkhhId0r1nytbO9v3+W6a8lGfNqkB9m DG6nwlR6rQP/F1igNfvH6GCl9DaWliBqDeIh4Q0GqAWsHiAgkDPU7T4yB+pzS7FT/HqE Ro3ozG+My4OUq3jBBtutbdbhjVX65q/h+AJuY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=HNmGES+uLO9YsOffNa2fh2cjLoKL9uHUoQbt+3rvIYeexCA7cdhHnJflGsjLIUKEHZ LHE5GD99p3WBHOOxyBzEh8euSSeC9wOh7VjtdLzVY6oegmy/Z2faEcvZ4+0Naq2zayCW DQVg/XfTx4j1F8Jp4056XQxDkZE6I0VO6ZmlU= Received: by 10.90.4.23 with SMTP id 23mr403177agd.7.1291699832318; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:32 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.19.201 with SMTP id c9ls5645893ibb.1.p; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.34.199 with SMTP id m7mr567079ibd.10.1291699831399; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.34.199 with SMTP id m7mr567073ibd.10.1291699831014; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iw0-f181.google.com (mail-iw0-f181.google.com [209.85.214.181]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id j25si2219584ibb.4.2010.12.06.21.30.29; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:30 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.181; Received: by mail-iw0-f181.google.com with SMTP id 3so16555200iwn.26 for ; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:29 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.35.196 with SMTP id q4mr6901401ibd.170.1291699829794; Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:30:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.199.206 with HTTP; Mon, 6 Dec 2010 21:30:29 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5f573729-3472-4289-ac7b-ea199a91e651@i25g2000prd.googlegroups.com> References: <5f573729-3472-4289-ac7b-ea199a91e651@i25g2000prd.googlegroups.com> Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2010 00:30:29 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: na'e vs no'e/to'e From: Luke Bergen To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.181 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0022152d5cbd82e87b0496cb4d32 --0022152d5cbd82e87b0496cb4d32 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 based on the definitions, I agree, lindar. One of the questions though was "what does no'e broda" look like when the "scaleness" of "broda" is really a scale of two states. It's kind of like when I drive by the town of middlesex. It always gives me pause. Just how would one define a "middle gender"? What does it mean to be {no'e} on a scale that only has two states (presumably they are opposite states). And on these two state scales, {na'e} and {to'e} have the same meaning (with perhaps subtle nuanced differences). Leaving aside transgender issues; polar opposite of female = other than female :: to'e fetsi = na'e fetsi. So what is {no'e fetsi}? Like I said earlier, truely two-state scales are extremely hard to find in the real world. One can always find ways in which a two-state system can have fuzzy middle-grounds. i.e. zombies, ajar doors, hermaphrodites, standby mode, sleep-walking, etc... so it might be somewhat of a moot question in real world applications. On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 10:30 PM, Lindar wrote: > I would like to submit the following: > > My interpretation is this: > > je'a blabi - white > no'e blabi - grey > to'e blabi - black > > na'e blabi - any colour other than white > > > It implies a scale *or set*. > > If that's not exactly how it's used, that's how I use it, and that's > how it should be used. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --0022152d5cbd82e87b0496cb4d32 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable based on the definitions, I agree, lindar.

One of the qu= estions though was "what does no'e broda" look like when the = "scaleness" of "broda" is really a scale of two states.=

It's kind of like when I drive by the town of middl= esex. =A0It always gives me pause. =A0Just how would one define a "mid= dle gender"? =A0What does it mean to be {no'e} on a scale that onl= y has two states (presumably they are opposite states).

And on these two state scales, {na'e} and {to'e= } have the same meaning (with perhaps subtle nuanced differences). =A0Leavi= ng aside transgender issues; =A0polar opposite of female =3D other than fem= ale :: to'e fetsi =3D na'e fetsi. =A0So what is {no'e fetsi}?

Like I said earlier, truely two-state scales are extrem= ely hard to find in the real world. =A0One can always find ways in which a = two-state system can have fuzzy middle-grounds. =A0i.e. zombies, ajar doors= , hermaphrodites, standby mode, sleep-walking, etc... so it might be somewh= at of a moot question in real world applications.

On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 10:30 PM, Lindar <lindarthebard@= yahoo.com> wrote:
I would like to submit the following:

My interpretation is this:

je'a blabi - white
no'e blabi - grey
to'e blabi - black

na'e blabi - any colour other than white


It implies a scale *or set*.

If that's not exactly how it's used, that's how I use it, and t= hat's
how it should be used.

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