From lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRCKr57pBBoE1nqy1A@googlegroups.com Fri Jan 07 14:45:44 2011 Received: from mail-yx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.213.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PbL3z-0002LA-SM; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:44 -0800 Received: by yxn35 with SMTP id 35sf16492427yxn.16 for ; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:34 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:message-id:x-ymail-osg:received :x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=lHhTB4eWcoAkXG1qRmM52jF3ED4ScrukAMbIpgAiFZY=; b=m4xe4f71JjTx5gCbIq/HUZNw9m1RcJwubEcZQ2HuEE6tjRHwmowo5fKmnMJM2bUt67 Etma0eCgwCPBYhefjWhqABuRl24EAxZRbqIZD1Hp5eXfvivDi010n5K5CU4BPgNGWV6H Vh4mPjdGwMw6Ue4/mXdmhT6S5EunGuZ6rqTII= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:message-id:x-ymail-osg:x-mailer:references :date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=4l0FtG8VM7P8cShrqrTsMZ8iiFA41hKE3kcf+hR0HmwJmoe8q5KNPBuXU9Ve/GNb+6 ZRA8DU0poFD9nh9cDuDWOBczaLgBunB9VPP1SbOg+aWSTZdUwsFU3BYwRiAZIXvSlo8u dMyb2ByYjfrHYp7f6ESBoVbjx3XRSAbijF1dw= Received: by 10.90.11.38 with SMTP id 38mr261283agk.32.1294440330366; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:30 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.100.56.38 with SMTP id e38ls3585936ana.3.p; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.100.13.10 with SMTP id 10mr3405850anm.30.1294440329755; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.100.13.10 with SMTP id 10mr3405849anm.30.1294440329723; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.118]) by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id q5si10854834anf.4.2011.01.07.14.45.28; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:28 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 68.142.199.118 as permitted sender) client-ip=68.142.199.118; Received: (qmail 25250 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Jan 2011 22:45:28 -0000 Message-ID: <44615.24746.qm@web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: NacM4ZUVM1ki49beO0gPvtmMpbZjzXpNNTyEryOrdBaOg4l q8w7bi34MY1za3iLDAS7KLo_TlShaRLBP2sm1X3bRi39VvaGHobErWUbookG IPJ21WcxyRc3Pc_Dt7FevCFKe_oYp3CFhGe9gJuxIi5nd3q8ooZirp1RCVAH uD.at1jMzfqxNJvFvRlGlxaRfYjoyTr0WP2uT2WSsjdok0siICV17ypgGFl4 RYez7YMXgv.dnPVL9SfsgKT_AvVvLneD5irzaIrf6BeE45cJkaMd9uPJYdxW lttaJNNYYkVFkgT1E5rwk0m0GuVjny7XVeSzAA0pcmo1sw56TQos6_Ur349S ymtZkBhQSln.fBiQ7d_jtU9AXdI5yAFQnjHNPp3FFGbe66K1tAcH0MmZiY6o 4cphK25Mh8xgN Received: from [99.92.110.13] by web81302.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:45:27 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/553 YahooMailWebService/0.8.107.285259 References: <9114501.161.1294150198377.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yqhy19> <7c0687a1-deba-495a-9760-95d1d0649423@t8g2000prh.googlegroups.com> <20110105165231.GK17534@digitalkingdom.org> <20110105220532.GN17534@digitalkingdom.org> <673286.9022.qm@web81303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 14:45:27 -0800 (PST) From: John E Clifford Subject: Re: Lojban is *NOT* broken! Stop saying that! (was Re: [lojban] Re: Vote for the Future Global Language) To: lojban@googlegroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: kali9putra@yahoo.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 68.142.199.118 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=kali9putra@yahoo.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@yahoo.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-182538001-1294440327=:24746" --0-182538001-1294440327=:24746 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 But "Do you want pie OR ice cream" almost always is XOR -- even with "or", when children (regardless of age) are involved. ________________________________ From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com Sent: Fri, January 7, 2011 4:33:33 PM Subject: Re: Lojban is *NOT* broken! Stop saying that! (was Re: [lojban] Re: Vote for the Future Global Language) On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Ivo Doko wrote: On 7 January 2011 02:06, John E Clifford wrote: > >It doesn't matter what the waiter emphasized. >> >You either don't know English well enough or are just ignoring the importance of >emphasizing for the sake of your point. The question is the same regardless of emphasis. Also, in the real world, the question is never an XOR question, so saying "CREAM or SUGAR" does not suggest that the customer can have only one or the other, but merely that the customer is hard of hearing. -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --0-182538001-1294440327=:24746 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
But "Do you want pie OR ice cream" almost always is XOR -= - even with "or", when children (regardless of age) are involved.
=


From: Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@= gmail.com>
To: lojba= n@googlegroups.com
Sent: Fri, January 7, 2011 4:33:33 PM
= Subject: Re: Lojban is *NOT* broken! Stop saying that! (was Re: = [lojban] Re: Vote for the Future Global Language)

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Ivo Doko <ivo.doko@gmail.com&g= t; wrote:
On 7 January 2011 02:06, John = E Clifford <ka= li9putra@yahoo.com> wrote:
It doesn't matter what the waiter emphasized.
<= /blockquote>

You either don't know English well enough or ar= e just ignoring the importance of emphasizing for the sake of your point.

The question is the same regardless of emphasis.

Also, in = the real world, the question is never an XOR question, so saying "CREAM or = SUGAR" does not suggest that the customer can have only one or the other, b= ut merely that the customer is hard of hearing.

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pil= no be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke,= I am your father. :D )

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