From lojban+bncCOjSjrXVGBC8l-PpBBoE3jQYrw@googlegroups.com Thu Jan 20 15:57:04 2011 Received: from mail-qy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.216.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Pg4N6-0001Tf-M5; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:57:04 -0800 Received: by qyl38 with SMTP id 38sf2632338qyl.16 for ; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:50 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=OPue/H+3CgMAkr0CgQeK+U4gHj5bsZdnu6CAXZDSnDA=; b=IkpguO2Hdc2uNeDAwviE2JvooSlH6JkjZG/ke/XA/0L7koOQ6aMbYVXH8qVazOhVqJ pfyQCqCgATSXkFigCPOfBl0MJ/8TVr+oPHO76P+YLpib3kbwOu4AXrvTt6kFuX+yHtE+ hhXosn1v1JekVzE1ASH6nz6iDc84GLIaBgaog= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from :to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=PGYgbDnnsHUbhKI4q7NnFrIJXTkeAXPaCPBUFuVTG0QTMbItykYenCWZ3Yq9YU/Osj OM9WcS4+ZKgMc46TJZbTkBna5YT7IU/af6a6UX+EDEgYFIzf66H+Azd9SdDu15ClRtGo 8a/O6JbNqODHTMGgQlbsfOoOMS35GLHOY/Prs= Received: by 10.229.15.16 with SMTP id i16mr467747qca.43.1295567804610; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:44 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.195.134 with SMTP id ec6ls377671qcb.2.p; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.90.170 with SMTP id i42mr338149qcm.2.1295567803831; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.90.170 with SMTP id i42mr338148qcm.2.1295567803809; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vw0-f51.google.com (mail-vw0-f51.google.com [209.85.212.51]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ey28si2018315qcb.15.2011.01.20.15.56.42 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:42 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.51 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.212.51; Received: by vws20 with SMTP id 20so514936vws.10 for ; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:42 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.180.67 with SMTP id bt3mr700687vcb.227.1295567802407; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.118.212 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.118.212 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jan 2011 15:56:42 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2011 18:56:42 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] lo drata darlu From: Luke Bergen To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.51 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=90e6ba53aaa6a51a37049a4fe2e9 --90e6ba53aaa6a51a37049a4fe2e9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable .u'u .i sa'u .i broda cei ko'a sevmrori'a va'ojemu'i lo nu lo nu nei kei cu rinka lo nu lo drata cu jmive .i brode cei ko'a na'e pensi gi'e romoi broda va'o lo nu cumki .i brodi cei ko'a pensi .ijebo va'o lo nu lo drata cu zmad= u ko'a lo ka vajni lo remna keikei ko'a broda lo drata .iku'ibo va'o lo nu ko'a zmadu lo drata kei ko'a na broda .i zmadu fi lo ka virdu kei fi'a brod= e fi'a brodi .u'ucai I think this is one of those times where my lojban is just not up to the task of expressing such a complex concept. In english then: is it more virtuous to blindly sacrifice onesself in order to save another, or is it more virtuous to consider probabalistically which life is more important to hummanity and act accordingly? i.e. if bob is on the brink of a breakthrough cure for cancer, should he be considered virtuous for sacrificing his life to save a homeless guy on the street? On Jan 20, 2011 5:16 PM, "Jorge Llamb=EDas" wrote: --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --90e6ba53aaa6a51a37049a4fe2e9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

.u'u .i sa'u .i broda cei ko'a sevmrori'a va'ojemu&#= 39;i lo nu lo nu nei kei cu rinka lo nu lo drata cu jmive .i brode cei ko&#= 39;a na'e pensi gi'e romoi broda va'o lo nu cumki .i brodi cei = ko'a pensi .ijebo va'o lo nu lo drata cu zmadu ko'a lo ka vajni= lo remna keikei ko'a broda lo drata .iku'ibo va'o lo nu ko'= ;a zmadu lo drata kei ko'a na broda .i zmadu fi lo ka virdu kei fi'= a brode fi'a brodi

.u'ucai

I think this is one of those times where my lojban is just not up to the= task of expressing such a complex concept.=A0 In english then:=A0 is it mo= re virtuous to blindly sacrifice onesself in order to save another, or is i= t more virtuous to consider probabalistically which life is more important = to hummanity and act accordingly?

i.e. if bob is on the brink of a breakthrough cure for cancer, should he= be considered virtuous for sacrificing his life to save a homeless guy on = the street?

On Jan 20, 2011 5:16 PM, "Jorge Llamb=EDas&= quot; <jjllambias@gmail.com&= gt; wrote:

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