From lojban+bncCLr6ktCfBBCOlPzpBBoEh4KZXQ@googlegroups.com Tue Jan 25 09:36:35 2011 Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Phmob-0007cK-Hv; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:34 -0800 Received: by gxk19 with SMTP id 19sf4603803gxk.16 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject :message-id:mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; bh=v0iGVLGwgDOYnSW0kL5A6JlrIZ4V8B/S/rOH0dTpHM0=; b=bqJj07o2GZaSTvfeDb9S91+rnAoAX/wiLcDjQAGMq8T1v7lDXfgy6mcvDA7ksDDwBz /qDUyueVY34CKMHDodHXY9ZN3xaLyo2NDTwXGsCYDxQfd3/+Haxk541U5OYWJL1nNXgU iF6PVNcGL9ZQOepOH4olM5AIW1XQqZtyg7WRc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; b=bjH6CRvef1sKiZSAZn2CXOaoCFgXovscScK7n5UKZzlGwtQG0D3p2ZzIWf+hPSiRyV SeeDeew53ZCm25ocDqBGN9zhvEGueiik62xf13yZiHOVZz/EweRlKsZmiHdbeot2pW7u /lR0/OSev63isHHyeXG2xbS7uQbOn5VhVZ/ms= Received: by 10.91.62.6 with SMTP id p6mr444356agk.20.1295976974012; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:14 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.150.111.2 with SMTP id j2ls489467ybc.0.p; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.230.19 with SMTP id c19mr2382241ybh.43.1295976972716; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.230.19 with SMTP id c19mr2382238ybh.43.1295976972662; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-yi0-f41.google.com (mail-yi0-f41.google.com [209.85.218.41]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id g10si110214yhd.13.2011.01.25.09.36.12 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.85.218.41 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) client-ip=209.85.218.41; Received: by yia25 with SMTP id 25so2007114yia.14 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.164.4 with SMTP id m4mr6398074ybe.407.1295976972215; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from sunflowerriver.org (173-10-243-253-Albuquerque.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [173.10.243.253]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id q8sm521872yhg.1.2011.01.25.09.36.10 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 25 Jan 2011 09:36:11 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 10:36:07 -0700 From: ".alyn.post." To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] zoi bug in camxes? Message-ID: <20110125173607.GA30364@alice.local> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20110125010006.GZ26224@digitalkingdom.org> <3251036.256.1295936084612.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yqcj39> <20110125070730.GB26224@digitalkingdom.org> <20110125171957.GF26224@digitalkingdom.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20110125171957.GF26224@digitalkingdom.org> X-Original-Sender: alyn.post@lodockikumazvati.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 209.85.218.41 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) smtp.mail=alanpost@sunflowerriver.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 09:19:57AM -0800, Robin Lee Powell wrote: > On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 09:01:34AM -0300, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Robin Lee Powell > > wrote: > > > > > > it shouldn't be processing stuff inside the zoi quote at all. > > > =A0"gyrate" or "gyrations" or whatever shouldn't be able to be > > > matched as the delimiter because "gy" isn't *seperated out as a > > > word* there. > >=20 > > The text inside the quote "zoi gy gy" is the empty string. > > Following this with the Lojban words "ra", "te", "gy" makes no > > difference, there is no "processing stuff inside the quote" going > > on here since there is no stuff inside the quote to process, other > > than a space. >=20 > I understand what you're saying, I simply disagree that zoi should > work that way; the ending particle should have to be completely > delimited. >=20 > I don't actually *care* all that much, it's just my feeling on the > matter. >=20 From the conversation, I can summarize three separate proposals: 1) leave the PEG grammar alone and correct the CLL to describe the way this grammar is behaving. 2) replace the rule for zoi-word to match non-lojban-word rather than any-word, so 'gyrate' won't be divided into three words, satisfying Robin's consistency argument. We'll still need to update the CLL for the behavior, I think. 3) Replace the PEG grammar with something that reads the stuff between the ZOI delimiter a character at a time. Either require a pause before the final delimiter or not. I like 2, 1, and then 3 in that order. 3 I don't like because the rest of the grammar doesn't really work that way. The grammar is defined by token streams and the morphology file handles composing the input stream into tokens. 3 Is not completely unprecedented, however, FAhO does something similar. 2 I like because because of the argument Robin raised about consistency. I think it is surprising that gyrate is invalid but gyration is valid, and I don't think that surprise is a useful feature. I can't think of a reason to dislike 2, please help me with that. 1 Has the advantage of working that way right now. It also has the advantage of prefering Lojbanic text to non-Lojbanic text. ZOI isn't special from that perspective, the parser does what the parse does ZOI or not. Will you give me your preference ordering? I'd like to know whether I should: a) update the CLL errata. b) update the PEG grammar. c) raise an issue with the BPFK to make a decision. I'll use the preference ordering to make a choice. -Alan --=20 .i ko djuno fi le do sevzi --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.