From lojban+bncCLr6ktCfBBDhlv3pBBoEHEMwuQ@googlegroups.com Tue Jan 25 14:15:13 2011 Received: from mail-gw0-f61.google.com ([74.125.83.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PhrAL-0007bf-0B; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:15:13 -0800 Received: by gwb20 with SMTP id 20sf4777962gwb.16 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:15:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject :message-id:mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; bh=94Cru7KmDqM1yo8ACIKP++iqHy5J2tLCOWMG7e9PHng=; b=C661fo5PaJRoQNAV5MdXaLwJH8cfKx0zapuIprOXgx0LBiibzWosne+d2upjXgIJ6m Ry/b8CmZjp3l4SKV7iPa5wAdCUFxLS1IcX+2isIoIRpcMc3i616JuERT3CLBDmC0N1Sk DuYbsRZRR52zUJuzNkR81q7LNChievycMyu5E= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding; b=3XgGCzLBzg+PN3fRyJDuiQGwdECmwQS3S99bs2PB1UjZYPWt7aPhew3Yf7UQjViOOH fnF5hXukjPH1XeJQxDEUD4ChttLO1M73KFk4a8CuPjoulIt4Ao9zDGwmVAUDxVnbpi9v EZ2JYGjf6aojQyUT/o2sxwtdSAMA8Eh3GMom8= Received: by 10.150.189.19 with SMTP id m19mr24950ybf.29.1295993697081; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:57 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.150.111.2 with SMTP id j2ls27315ybc.0.p; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.236.110.10 with SMTP id t10mr129795yhg.9.1295993696269; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.236.110.10 with SMTP id t10mr129794yhg.9.1295993696244; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-gx0-f178.google.com (mail-gx0-f178.google.com [209.85.161.178]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id i23si150260yhd.5.2011.01.25.14.14.56 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:56 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.85.161.178 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) client-ip=209.85.161.178; Received: by mail-gx0-f178.google.com with SMTP id 25so2307192gxk.37 for ; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.150.146.18 with SMTP id t18mr201930ybd.185.1295993695936; Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from sunflowerriver.org (173-10-243-253-Albuquerque.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [173.10.243.253]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v39sm4018036yba.7.2011.01.25.14.14.54 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 25 Jan 2011 14:14:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 15:14:51 -0700 From: ".alyn.post." To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] zoi bug in camxes? Message-ID: <20110125221451.GC35838@alice.local> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20110125010006.GZ26224@digitalkingdom.org> <3251036.256.1295936084612.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@yqcj39> <20110125070730.GB26224@digitalkingdom.org> <20110125171957.GF26224@digitalkingdom.org> <20110125173607.GA30364@alice.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: alyn.post@lodockikumazvati.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 209.85.161.178 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) smtp.mail=alanpost@sunflowerriver.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 07:13:01PM -0300, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > On Tue, Jan 25, 2011 at 2:36 PM, .alyn.post. > wrote: > > > > From the conversation, I can summarize three separate proposals: > > > > 1) leave the PEG grammar alone and correct the CLL to describe the > > =A0 way this grammar is behaving. >=20 > This is currently my preference. >=20 > > 2) replace the rule for zoi-word to match non-lojban-word rather > > =A0 than any-word, so 'gyrate' won't be divided into three words, > > =A0 satisfying Robin's consistency argument. =A0We'll still need to > > =A0 update the CLL for the behavior, I think. >=20 > Notice that "gyrate" does NOT match "non-lojban-word" (and neither > does "gyrations" for that matter). You probably mean something else, > some new rule like "string-of-phonemes-without-space <- non-space+". > This also relates to the ZOhOI proposal. >=20 > Yes, CLL needs updating in any case. Robin requires the final > delimiter to be followed by a pause, which CLL does not. >=20 > > 3) Replace the PEG grammar with something that reads the stuff > > =A0 between the ZOI delimiter a character at a time. =A0Either require > > =A0 a pause before the final delimiter or not. > > > > I like 2, 1, and then 3 in that order. >=20 > 1, 2, 3 for me. >=20 > > 2 I like because because of the argument Robin raised about > > consistency. =A0I think it is surprising that gyrate is invalid > > but gyration is valid, and I don't think that surprise is a useful > > feature. =A0I can't think of a reason to dislike 2, please help me > > with that. >=20 > But wouldn't "zoi mi miklama mi" as a valid quote be surprising? Are > you equally tempted to read "miklama" as a single word as you are to > read "gyrate" as one word, or are you just thinking English? >=20 > mu'o mi'e xorxes >=20 Excellent point, I do see miklama as two Lojban words. -Alan --=20 .i ko djuno fi le do sevzi --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.