From lojban+bncCNTPpI2KGxCrz6vqBBoEZM-DcA@googlegroups.com Thu Feb 03 09:37:04 2011 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Pl36z-0000HK-HS; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:37:04 -0800 Received: by vws1 with SMTP id 1sf643875vws.16 for ; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis :x-cloudmark-score:x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent :references:in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition; bh=sMYmITAEk+O3AZEh2jSX3D1x4ne7loqQJO908vR+ZJQ=; b=Qr7Uu+75hJfYiBN1gdaEyL5Y1r+wfNeKWNPDmhepCaWZT7IhyY7gdJRxOshraLMn0s YEWjv91xMI+19E8USwTnFTCdAd2CLt61UhNydbq4DM6KnBTKf2RQayWvuKkbwxOT0btu xzzi3i19Zo9g/OICobx1IsWKJ05rOF7QL9/n4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition; b=hvDLNsu0q3wuB3zZlaZ+dC3mvsKV8R1AJ50frdIA07F9Q2h/xttgyCL8GyVLDu7ecT 5ufG1IfxLNB6jXN25BsAT0xFz8aKa9J2wDt5S7FEl1lvFor4EcEqL99OLkjOoun96ve4 zez31N582pZwbV/7Oc/qfkCETGN4Eli7D3kvw= Received: by 10.220.176.66 with SMTP id bd2mr677523vcb.42.1296754603182; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:43 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.67.197 with SMTP id s5ls285481vci.2.p; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:41 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.201.193 with SMTP id fb1mr2385901vcb.1.1296754601904; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:41 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.201.193 with SMTP id fb1mr2385899vcb.1.1296754601877; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.122]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id x13si136585vcr.15.2011.02.03.09.36.41; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 09:36:41 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.122 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.122; X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=uESSSoDEku2quKX/oFXS2Smn5+55LTFcWFr5T5T8nFs= c=1 sm=0 a=wPDyFdB5xvgA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:17 a=qkqJHPajAAAA:8 a=rhMRrBtD4LoNDm80RL8A:9 a=nHyt2Y4iwCPQZTWum7EA:7 a=sX4rf03LU-cZbZM59vHM-lcQNN4A:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 75.176.118.168 Received: from [75.176.118.168] ([75.176.118.168:57934] helo=chausie) by cdptpa-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 27/5E-07087-8A7EA4D4; Thu, 03 Feb 2011 17:36:41 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2554017914 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2011 12:36:40 -0500 (EST) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Idea: Levels Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2011 12:36:36 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <20110203171000.GC56439@alice.local> In-Reply-To: <20110203171000.GC56439@alice.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <201102031236.37874.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.122 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline On Thursday 03 February 2011 12:10:00 .alyn.post. wrote: > If you want to do more than skim, here are the speaking and writing > guidelines: > > http://www.actfl.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=3349 > http://www.actfl.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=3326 > > It is probably still too nebulous and imprecise, though I claim it > is precisely 16 pages minus one promise better than what we have > so far. The speaking guidelines refer to interactions with native speakers, but as we don't have a lot of native speakers, that's hard to apply. The guidelines, being written for a wide variety of languages, don't say what the low-frequency structures and complex high-frequency structures are. Perhaps, for example, if there were a body of native speakers, the phrase "setese" would almost never occur in speech, except in the sentence "mi setese cusku naja catra .ei do" (If I tell you, I have to kill you). Should discussion of levels of proficiency be moved to the LBCK list? Pierre -- Jews use a lunisolar calendar; Muslims use a solely lunar calendar. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.