From lojban+bncCN673cmqFBDsgqHqBBoE6niiTA@googlegroups.com Tue Feb 01 09:23:12 2011 Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PkJwW-00051l-CZ; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:23:12 -0800 Received: by gxk19 with SMTP id 19sf4666709gxk.16 for ; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:x-vr-score :x-authority-analysis:x-cm-score:message-id:date:from:organization :user-agent:x-accept-language:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results :reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=3eWMmubdpIn9tu5DpKZ7QY4Jm9XtTGUV9kLtHr8iOdM=; b=m9mj+MA7s6OzYTmS1a9LGV6tGUKG+jovsIgx3T3y0BZnJg4XZMBk3dhaL7aeRUowdJ ZBO15uJ3UCdjIxl1Wret30FrKPCejhUh1q0SbuD7iy0zMNjGfIkybUYqAiEmLoHMDRto aB1CJMjfXz+l7lEnRmF4lt+jQrSZ4IjVPD7BA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-vr-score:x-authority-analysis:x-cm-score :message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:x-accept-language :mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=6QtAdvPHF6IbwCqvJyS8ykcdts+fexNBxxHoN+yFkH8zIWHp3pYLval1F3yXZClJMn Gko2vtQ4tBJ11jHtIHUpVGp7pWbFkQ6lbRa+iCxNzmYTkIxRKsLijYOLugNs0d69+R0O ul7pqOAbb9jg3x63sqPqFohSYfq/3szJ842V8= Received: by 10.150.202.12 with SMTP id z12mr810310ybf.81.1296580972135; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:52 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.150.173.16 with SMTP id v16ls3458245ybe.5.p; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.151.148.5 with SMTP id a5mr3246368ybo.12.1296580971327; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.151.148.5 with SMTP id a5mr3246366ybo.12.1296580971295; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from eastrmmtao106.cox.net (eastrmmtao106.cox.net [68.230.240.48]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id v5si3383104ybi.12.2011.02.01.09.22.50; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 09:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 68.230.240.48 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) client-ip=68.230.240.48; Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by eastrmmtao106.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.01.04.00 201-2260-137-20101110) with ESMTP id <20110201172250.WIPK24205.eastrmmtao106.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net> for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 12:22:50 -0500 Received: from [192.168.0.100] ([70.187.237.100]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id 2hNn1g0012AfMYu02hNnan; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 12:22:50 -0500 X-VR-Score: -80.00 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=K6H15zDybEznVbWvwx3O4PPp0p/D2/5TW7WmbNpAZQA= c=1 sm=1 a=nLcNcjRciQsA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=MQZuvjT3xUZLKv0gclfWMg==:17 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=8YJikuA2AAAA:8 a=T7d3nO2pAAAA:8 a=w1wRoy1sgVWAi888kn4A:9 a=Q2qxjLXqnWeoPocQDE0A:7 a=ppfE2tDVj9mSF4sSWaTRx-4KrOMA:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=IfXdPxev5WUA:10 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=dxBpO5_FDU0A:10 a=MQZuvjT3xUZLKv0gclfWMg==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: <4D484163.1040002@lojban.org> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 12:22:43 -0500 From: "Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG" Organization: The Logical Language Group, Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Lojban to TLI Loglan References: In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 68.230.240.48 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) smtp.mail=lojbab@lojban.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cyril Slobin wrote: > 2011/1/30 Jorge Llamb=EDas : >>My Loglan dictionary has "gacpi" for Lojban "gleki", and "claso" for >>Lojban "claxu" (and "nirve" for "kunti"). Are "hapci" and "clesi" >>typos or are they modern variants? gacpi became hapci and claso became clesi as part of GMR in 1982. There http://www.lojban.org/publications/wordlists/oldlog.txt has my effort to find the closest TLI equivalent to Lojban gismu, but=20 there are place structure differences, as Cyril has noticed. Cyril and others are welcome to try to improve on the list, which is of=20 course over 17 years old, and thus even predates the current LLG baseline. > I haven't studied the Loglan history in deep, and don't know much of > it's elder versions. All Logli, who are meeting regularly in SL > (typically three or four -- not a very large community), are using LOD > (in Java or HTML form), which has "hapci" and "clesi" (and not "gacpi" > and "claso"). Both versions are downloadable from loglan.org site. As > far as I know, there is no primitive word for {kunti}, and the > compound word "nirveo" ("zero contain") lacks the {se kunti} place > (empty of which material?). I have done my best replacing it with > "clesi".=20 Of course even in TLI Loglan, you were supposed to be able to coin new=20 lujvo, so you could come up with new ones that have the places that you=20 need, based on what is there. Limiting oneself to the closed wordlist=20 of LOD makes poetry especially difficult. lojbab --=20 Bob LeChevalier lojbab@lojban.org www.lojban.org President and Founder, The Logical Language Group, Inc. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.