From lojban+bncCLr6ktCfBBC487_qBBoE-24e6A@googlegroups.com Mon Feb 07 05:55:19 2011 Received: from mail-yi0-f61.google.com ([209.85.218.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PmRYh-0006xT-Uy; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:19 -0800 Received: by yia27 with SMTP id 27sf3085173yia.16 for ; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject :message-id:mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition; bh=71UXsDHQXVlYhhQWcv6PWX2GRBp3+L32bTCY4hXyMoo=; b=kwZ/Ps46P4PAWS/JR5USzbwh7mC2gKYJzmronVn319PxJxlktoX+Bzlt1REAOR5xbu kOQ5e8INkaSfiYfFMgRlWzm02KghGbKkiydRYPO0RAlpNpEl6HetPWcb9vGxgbMxl/Qc ssJYIiUASjpZKK4HKUktMsBub7Iho/f2cfimg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id :mail-followup-to:references:mime-version:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-disposition; b=6MT7pgq0fO6x9O7U77ym9XpFd7ZO9zhNxO677zE7Ql2NlcbjQqMe4f4b56DRH6cB27 eUGJb88VnZ8Wv/292XtESPTAX4zrWvkgGkaUW/kumlNii0JUbHb+ZCYL02FMfp0sfsRi U3+M8sJNIjNrITkrRYIFG2YVAjlRPRSa49nfQ= Received: by 10.236.110.17 with SMTP id t17mr146874yhg.13.1297086904480; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:04 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.57.97 with SMTP id b33ls3142645ibh.0.p; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.225.193 with SMTP id it1mr1763924icb.100.1297086903947; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.225.193 with SMTP id it1mr1763923icb.100.1297086903935; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iy0-f180.google.com (mail-iy0-f180.google.com [209.85.210.180]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id c4si553053ict.3.2011.02.07.05.55.03 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:03 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.85.210.180 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) client-ip=209.85.210.180; Received: by iyh42 with SMTP id 42so1483057iyh.39 for ; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.228.10 with SMTP id jc10mr18617791icb.11.1297086903744; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from sunflowerriver.org (86.sub-69-96-208.myvzw.com [69.96.208.86]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id t14sm3452252icd.10.2011.02.07.05.55.01 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 07 Feb 2011 05:55:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 06:54:58 -0700 From: ".alyn.post." To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] zo .y.bu cmavo lo zo bu jonai zo by xu Message-ID: <20110207135458.GC64322@86.sub-69-96-208.myvzw.com> Mail-Followup-To: lojban@googlegroups.com References: <20110207031019.GB63098@alice.local> <201102070013.31115.phma@phma.optus.nu> Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201102070013.31115.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Original-Sender: alyn.post@lodockikumazvati.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 209.85.210.180 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of alanpost@sunflowerriver.org) smtp.mail=alanpost@sunflowerriver.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline On Mon, Feb 07, 2011 at 12:13:30AM -0500, Pierre Abbat wrote: > On Sunday 06 February 2011 22:42:54 Ross Ogilvie wrote: > > la'e ko'a zo'u tu'a lo mapli cu natfe lo se xusra > > mapli ki'a? > > > .i mi na djuno lo du'u makau drani .i pe'i la'e ko'e plixau zmadu > > > > mu'o mi'e ros. > > > > The opening of Magic+Words asserts that ybu is BU near the beginning, but > > the example given below contradicts that > > broda .y. bu = broda + the letter y > > > > In short, I don't know. Certainly being able to talk about the letter y > > easily seems more useful than being allowed to yyyyy in the middle of a bu > > construction. > > Running various combinations through camxes, I find it impossible to > quote "y": > > broda y bu > text > bridiTail3 > |- BRIVLA > | gismu: broda > |- CMAVO > BY > |- y > |- bu > > zo y bu lervla > text > sentence > |- ZOPre > | |- CMAVO > | | ZO: zo > | |- CMAVO > | BY > | |- y > | |- bu > |- BRIVLA > lujvo: lervla > > zo abu lervla > text > sentence > |- buClauseNoPre > | |- ZOPre > | | |- CMAVO > | | | ZO: zo > | | |- CMAVO > | | A: a > | |- CMAVO > | BU: bu > |- BRIVLA > lujvo: lervla > > zo y na lervla > text > sentence > |- ZOPre > | |- CMAVO > | | ZO: zo > | |- CMAVO > | NA: na > |- BRIVLA > lujvo: lervla > > lu y li'u valsi > text > sentence > |- sumti6 > | |- CMAVO > | | LU: lu > | |- CMAVO > | LIhU: li'u > |- BRIVLA > gismu: valsi > > lo'u y le'u valsi > text > sentence > |- LOhUPre > | |- CMAVO > | | LOhU: lo'u > | |- CMAVO > | LEhU: le'u > |- BRIVLA > gismu: valsi > > zoi y valsi y valsi > text > ZOIPre > |- CMAVO > | ZOI: zoi > |- BRIVLA > | gismu: valsi > |- BRIVLA > gismu: valsi > > zoi gy y gy broda > text > sentence > |- ZOIPre > | |- CMAVO > | | ZOI: zoi > | |- CMAVO > | | BY: gy > | |- CMAVO > | BY: gy > |- BRIVLA > gismu: broda > .i bi di'u drani .i lo .ybu. valsi cu canlu lerfu .i do na ka'e sitna lo .abu valsi .i zo depsna basti .i zoi .fanva. These 8 examples are correct. "y" is whitespace. You can't quote "y". You say "hesitate." instead. .fanva. .i mu'o mi'e .alyn. -- .i ko djuno fi le do sevzi -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.