From lojban+bncCOjSjrXVGBCVrIrsBBoE1e6R0g@googlegroups.com Thu Mar 17 16:15:53 2011 Received: from mail-yx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.213.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Q0MPx-0006BL-6L; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:53 -0700 Received: by yxd5 with SMTP id 5sf2582758yxd.16 for ; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version :in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=/Nvlaha9eD2q+kPmzEJKdCVf784+H4SKtMKjhSGpqY4=; b=eSX9rmN6wFDYGfLUg43dxP3EN79mSD9NzbZus+bn9X/gtQ0/aL1aRCIosl9nk/mWJ2 sUuF382eUNml4659OhwlymKU1Mq1NihwpU5CVMdmSJM+i2flS62cfWsU6KQQANRWvuMt onBujm01XXyf/7hsRG42YzPZcEqafNrxsbHjI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=2evTfFHqtH0i1o8rdJeVEkMIBaAoOLklElQUxd3AsY75uKyB71Ltn4t9RKSx8VYpTI koIavPMhM7gjyHy1jI7qhb8qCapgkQz4uXyzT5029soi1Ghj0vWt1sk9FfUDxl6u6iNE +TUOff80ZXIts3Pz8vkq7i1Zhnl1T51RCzbeY= Received: by 10.91.103.7 with SMTP id f7mr81345agm.20.1300403733272; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:33 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.1.79 with SMTP id 15ls2947778ibe.0.p; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.113.84 with SMTP id z20mr27165ibp.19.1300403732394; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.113.84 with SMTP id z20mr27162ibp.19.1300403732344; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iw0-f172.google.com (mail-iw0-f172.google.com [209.85.214.172]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id j25si515552ibb.0.2011.03.17.16.15.32 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.172 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.172; Received: by iwl42 with SMTP id 42so4953760iwl.17 for ; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.43.59.80 with SMTP id wn16mr680001icb.67.1300403732132; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.206.207 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Mar 2011 16:15:12 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <201103171235.31282.phma@phma.optus.nu> From: Luke Bergen Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2011 19:15:12 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] opposite of an extreme To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.172 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec51dd23b84b1d0049eb5d657 --bcaec51dd23b84b1d0049eb5d657 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable And it sometimes feels like a "modern home" means "latest spiffiest spigots and cool new dishwasher technology" almost like a {mlibalvi}. I think mayb= e "modern" can be thought of as (depending on the context) "very (not old)" (i.e. modern english is not ancient english and a modern home is a home tha= t doesn't have old appliances). So, is there a difference between {mutce nalylaldo} and {to'e laldo}? I think maybe the first can be thought of as "modern" while the latter is something like "{se} ancient" (which btw I think {tcepru} really deserves a= n x2 and maybe even an x3). What if I want to say "lo rirxe cu tcepru lo cabna mi .iku'i lo rirxe cu na tcepru lo cabna lo cmana". On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 4:34 PM, Ian Johnson wrote= : > It'd be nice to be able to use something to take brivla that don't have "= by > standard xn" places and make a lujvo that has a place like that. For > example, if we were going to make a lujvo for "modern", I think Pierre's > example of "Modern English" suggests that it have a standard place. > > For example, we could coin {stana} to mean "x1 is a standard for x2". Not > sure if we would want to fragment this depending on the epistemological > context, but this would be an easy enough hack for the time being. > > mu'o mi'e .latros. > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 12:35 PM, Pierre Abbat wrote= : > >> On Thursday 17 March 2011 01:13:52 Luke Bergen wrote: >> > would you interpret {to'e tcepru} as {cabna} or {tcebalvi}? >> > >> > It sounds right that the opposite of "ancient past" is "very modern". >> But >> > it also seems like the present is a mid-point between the ancient past >> and >> > the distant future. So both {cabna} and {tcebalvi} seem like >> intuitively >> > good interpretations. >> >> I think {to'e tcepru} is equivalent to {tcebalvi}. >> >> What are good words for "modern"? Sometimes {cabna} isn't quite right. F= or >> instance, Modern English has been spoken since around 1550, but no one >> living >> in Shakespeare's day could now be called {cabna}. >> >> Pierre >> -- >> When a barnacle settles down, its brain disintegrates. >> J=E1 n=E3o percebe nada, j=E1 n=E3o percebe nada. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Group= s >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den. --bcaec51dd23b84b1d0049eb5d657 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable And it sometimes feels like a "modern home" means "latest sp= iffiest spigots and cool new dishwasher technology" almost like a {mli= balvi}. =A0I think maybe "modern" can be thought of as (depending= on the context) "very (not old)" (i.e. modern english is not anc= ient english and a modern home is a home that doesn't have old applianc= es).

So, is there a difference between {mutce nalylaldo} and {to&= #39;e laldo}? =A0I think maybe the first can be thought of as "modern&= quot; while the latter is something like "{se} ancient" (which bt= w I think {tcepru} really deserves an x2 and maybe even an x3).

What if I want to say "lo rirxe cu tcepru lo cabna= mi .iku'i lo rirxe cu na tcepru lo cabna lo cmana". =A0

=
On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 4:34 PM, Ian Johnson <blindbravado@gmail.com> wrote:
It'd be nice to be able to use something= to take brivla that don't have "by standard xn" places and m= ake a lujvo that has a place like that. For example, if we were going to ma= ke a lujvo for "modern", I think Pierre's example of "Mo= dern English" suggests that it have a standard place.

For example, we could coin {stana} to mean "x1 is a standard for x= 2". Not sure if we would want to fragment this depending on the episte= mological context, but this would be an easy enough hack for the time being= .

mu'o mi'e .latros.


On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 12:35 PM, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optu= s.nu> wrote:
On Thursday 17 March 2011 01:13:52 Luke Bergen wrote:
> would you interpret {to'e tcepru} as {cabna} or {tcebalvi}?
>
> It sounds right that the opposite of "ancient past" is "= ;very modern". =A0But
> it also seems like the present is a mid-point between the ancient past= and
> the distant future. =A0So both {cabna} and {tcebalvi} seem like intuit= ively
> good interpretations.

I think {to'e tcepru} is equivalent to {tcebalvi}.

What are good words for "modern"? Sometimes {cabna} isn't qui= te right. For
instance, Modern English has been spoken since around 1550, but no one livi= ng
in Shakespeare's day could now be called {cabna}.

Pierre
--
When a barnacle settles down, its brain disintegrates.
J=E1 n=E3o percebe nada, j=E1 n=E3o percebe nada.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.


--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
--bcaec51dd23b84b1d0049eb5d657--