From lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRCO4PvtBBoElOhylg@googlegroups.com Mon May 02 10:55:40 2011 Received: from mail-gy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.160.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QGxLM-0001bz-Lv; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:40 -0700 Received: by gyf1 with SMTP id 1sf10773368gyf.16 for ; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf :x-yahoo-newman-property:x-yahoo-newman-id:message-id:x-ymail-osg :x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ydR/yRRQSflstXjFx6GXcWKiS67pX777vyoKAoR97Xc=; b=k9vIaUyuGifNOnom7oy62uBvjv04XICsYifAFD5DToT/ARCk0TWoy/qnmbGgnrqxn6 A3nRQz6Aa5kXo7KEyzUX4UI8+dH7UM7XVdgT+qrPACeMYuMjpXBNNHLewb/u6VEG3ND+ eP8g9PSCqNgPzfGf13o9VpKpthnFEYtwHmClQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-yahoo-newman-property:x-yahoo-newman-id :message-id:x-ymail-osg:x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to :in-reply-to:mime-version:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=fZ5nDdOXcXOcpxdLQVrUShrKzlbVALmaQH6R2Ce3QNeUpUURxGjA12EFQboIj6WbNK Lb5BgRv7vRAarjs4NyuRxOcvaj+97p0LsfcJudALHke0QuO+2OZNF2g4INcDgkTX74zb s8QQo6CgkZkKAyhEXwmqk/7qoWnpS4OuCRCiw= Received: by 10.236.109.147 with SMTP id s19mr295243yhg.54.1304358926967; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:26 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.150.105.18 with SMTP id d18ls3360531ybc.7.gmail; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.109.132 with SMTP id s4mr532449yhg.6.1304358926358; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.109.132 with SMTP id s4mr532448yhg.6.1304358926330; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nm15.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm15.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.216]) by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id v10si1160581ybe.1.2011.05.02.10.55.26; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:26 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 66.94.237.216 as permitted sender) client-ip=66.94.237.216; Received: from [66.94.237.195] by nm15.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 May 2011 17:55:26 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.102] by tm6.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 May 2011 17:55:26 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1007.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 May 2011 17:55:25 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 988402.39035.bm@omp1007.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 13328 invoked by uid 60001); 2 May 2011 17:55:25 -0000 Message-ID: <737349.12591.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: tk18zNcVM1lksgIqfDcXHU.alR8q0YQTPzbDHSjaQqoOMWd kX1lvEQu3WPBYkN7G3IGOMvNLlqRFY6W7aYyTJhJ.T.mf8GjABnBHr64J1cX ftkA01ar2yn9jw7UgSdsuKEL35N.Ojs.fY4hlXFbRoZrdZs82YADfh_lnRra xtQcxBex1lqr77jqpwLjiTrqQm.jDNYw_DoBkx7LyqC8H8QeuoqV4doRbvxS YANFBy8J4W5FFiRg2FJ2Eax1AbL6Ydnw5OpCEYx59WPC13vD49CMvg9i9CQE HMeg4K8.jjGDhdlRDDe626.9nkv_IPQuVW9yoMU2oxZX6EdncRmoM5hoDIFV 01GsxAP3c9zTyNd0k1Sy9KGQ39J5CaalzcfOhmABgTBM_ZBGGmMM5Hvg9LA- - Received: from [99.92.108.41] by web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 May 2011 10:55:25 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/559 YahooMailWebService/0.8.110.299900 References: <347891.1785.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <201105021943.53482.jezuch@interia.pl> Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 10:55:25 -0700 (PDT) From: John E Clifford Subject: Re: [lojban] xorlo and default quantifiers To: lojban@googlegroups.com In-Reply-To: <201105021943.53482.jezuch@interia.pl> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: kali9putra@yahoo.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 66.94.237.216 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=kali9putra@yahoo.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@yahoo.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I pretty sure it worked itself out over the last 35 years but that it was e= ver=20 actually summarized somewhere, I doubt. The various meanings were not=20 simultaneous, but one evolved into another as we lost interest in one or th= ought=20 we had solved it, though most have come back from time to time to haunt us.= I=20 am not sure I could describe all of them but one was collective action (mor= e or=20 less correctly described over the years), another was something called Mr. = Broda=20 (for each predicate, broda) which was an intensional object of some sort,= =20 present wherever a broda was and it all it parts (Quines infamous lavagai, = more=20 or less, or some Trobriand islander) and having whatever properties any bro= da=20 had, another was broda goo, the stuff all brodas were made of (the extensi= onal=20 analog of Mr. Broda, more or less). That's all I can think of at the momen= t,=20 but there were more and numerous variations on these. Mr. Broda has disappe= ared,=20 I think, but the collective sense is in xorlo and the goo sense is in=20 collectives of pieces of brodas. All of them floated around 'lo'. ----- Original Message ---- From: Krzysztof Sobolewski To: lojban@googlegroups.com Sent: Mon, May 2, 2011 12:43:52 PM Subject: Re: [lojban] xorlo and default quantifiers Dnia poniedzia=B3ek, 2 maja 2011 o 17:33:07 John E Clifford napisa=B3(a): > Yucky-poo! I thought we agreed at some point never to use "mass" again; = it has=20 > > been used over the years for at least four clearly different things and a= t=20 >least=20 > > as many that were not clear at all. All of the useful notions have been = spun=20 > off in different ways now, so there is no need for this term. Is it documented somewhere? I'd rather ask for a pointer than to ask you to= =20 explain what are those four things etc. for a potentially a millionth time = :) --=20 Ecce Jezuch "Wired were the eyes of a horse on a jet pilot One that smiled when he flew over the bay" - S. Tankian ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Matura 2011 - rozwiazemy dla was zadania! Sprawdz - http://linkint.pl/f299f --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups= =20 "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to=20 lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at=20 http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.