From lojban+bncCIywt_XDCRCKnfPvBBoEGkwuBA@googlegroups.com Sat Jun 18 09:13:10 2011 Received: from mail-yi0-f61.google.com ([209.85.218.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QXy8y-0001Y9-OL; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:13:10 -0700 Received: by yie12 with SMTP id 12sf4469815yie.16 for ; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:13:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf :x-yahoo-newman-property:x-yahoo-newman-id:message-id:x-ymail-osg :x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to:in-reply-to:mime-version :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=Z2zbXG/NKnIzn00T8ufXQQSUV3sUYfKdRW2o1IoYkx4=; b=saORUrkHXhO0ZqIe/UHLHfZbbx3FbaXyxsbdUfGg64SEcbqrq+SuV4SPMVZPcivus+ vorJP8CAKo0X4iTDnA6pyv8rkgsfolboyPcKezkT2+UC2Jm/zRbLjO5zbiK5WUsQpYiM WA+dbCPE+h8dnzp50RCc3OEg3qDdQQcqe25Ek= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-yahoo-newman-property:x-yahoo-newman-id :message-id:x-ymail-osg:x-mailer:references:date:from:subject:to :in-reply-to:mime-version:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; b=GrjAnmv0faFO1cA6gDxxJphU1y3qmDA3Kyvowh20/uvw6ByXAV5OT9fEYJs2bAQVua vs3+SnIfLnX9HEBfnNkiYafTO3zYnDCg6B5XPxW9jHMnEj8aLNB7S4IYoJtxC/TXD2b2 iQyM/r7csi1w3LDQsPrISmNCbcBTfLJ00oLq4= Received: by 10.101.165.20 with SMTP id s20mr313941ano.0.1308413578820; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:58 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.101.179.39 with SMTP id g39ls854306anp.4.gmail; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.101.97.12 with SMTP id z12mr1761421anl.15.1308413578028; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.101.97.12 with SMTP id z12mr1761420anl.15.1308413578003; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nm6-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com (nm6-vm0.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.94.237.158]) by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id v1si3320637anh.2.2011.06.18.09.12.57; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:57 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 66.94.237.158 as permitted sender) client-ip=66.94.237.158; Received: from [66.94.237.192] by nm6.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jun 2011 16:12:57 -0000 Received: from [66.94.237.101] by tm3.access.bullet.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jun 2011 16:12:57 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1006.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jun 2011 16:12:57 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 669764.85470.bm@omp1006.access.mail.mud.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 20021 invoked by uid 60001); 18 Jun 2011 16:12:57 -0000 Message-ID: <484951.98299.qm@web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: sH7FVt0VM1nIS1gFfo19uuhzPDEhPxyWy5q6r9IrHSEU0Gd .mphilgt4kATJZzyGp7JkcTsTsE3Oh.blQd9_C0V5OTDkUumNuCsyMcQqrZq p3kRHbLu2ErkGbdpE7P2dG86_Fzk1uS.eKy1VLKPW2ARHF2IQEWkOql2a2Yv 4RaaxLHMiIvdV0STOXmoJYkYOLDV6NapYXbNOiC9oDI6a08jt2vcHU.zgCdE g8_MZA8v0gkHGp8HebxwHiVcqwJBnX9yjIAO6yhgYaAtc9m6EdzqOoTw6VAA zAu9X75knfKLFt719ak7NStgr4loqec2y4YDM22JT8NFX2Y6uelLXFlko_24 DH.lvCYAVTsT9.FnmcG2BuvbjnIh3aHgIacsamLKWXRrv4xQU8ai5sAJ96rb E4Zfy107sVBh_5PAsq8LE7ZF7xT0LhF29eER6pLeLYWvMKl3xTWJWnoRjvN_ TO.wHfwNLIyfi9nURAebDm5nv__glrOVKX6XeWKRkevH.jm1UY2_o8vgn Received: from [99.92.108.41] by web81306.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:57 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/570 YahooMailWebService/0.8.111.304355 References: Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:12:57 -0700 (PDT) From: John E Clifford Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Category theory in lojban, or coining words To: lojban@googlegroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: kali9putra@yahoo.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: best guess record for domain of kali9putra@yahoo.com designates 66.94.237.158 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=kali9putra@yahoo.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@yahoo.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-367836327-1308413577=:98299" --0-367836327-1308413577=:98299 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Well, how experienced are you? And experience in one area of advanced mathematics need not carry over to others. though, by its nature, someone in category theory probably knows a bit about some other areas. The reverse is markedly not true as a rule. If the present problem is merely terminological, as it seems to be, then extensive knowledge is not needed -- we can either follow mathematical usage or insist on distinctions of some sort that usage does not., leaving context to decide. ________________________________ From: Alex Rozenshteyn To: lojban@googlegroups.com Sent: Sat, June 18, 2011 10:44:14 AM Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Category theory in lojban, or coining words mu'i lo su'u kucli ku da xu .e ma vu'o poi ke'a se mriste ti curve bo cmaci certu zmadu be mi Out of curiosity, is anyone on this list more experienced in pure math (pardon the malgli) than I am? On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 5:50 AM, Escape Landsome wrote: coi > >What this suggests me is that some inheritance mechanism is necessary. > >For instance, one can argue that addition in the case of natural >numbers is a particular case of concatenation for sequences of the >same unit "I". > >(i.e.: III & IIII = IIIIIII captures the meaning of 3 + 4 = 7, yet >concatenation is more general than addition, for IIJ & JJII = IIJJJII >has no equivalent in the natural integers set) > >So, if there were a word for "concatenation", say this is the word C, >it should bear some relation with the word for "integer addition", say >it is the word A. > >C ---> A > >For the same reason, "integer addition" should bear a strong >relationship with real addition, or complex addition. > >Natural languages resolve this problem by using the word "sum" for all >additions, and by coining usages of "con-caten-ation", or ' other >types of "sums" ' for the other cases... > >Regards > >-- .esk > >-- >You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >"lojban" group. >To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >For more options, visit this group at >http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > -- Alex R -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --0-367836327-1308413577=:98299 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, how experienced are you?  And experience in on= e area of advanced mathematics need not carry over to others. though, by it= s nature, someone in category theory probably knows a bit about some other = areas.  The reverse is markedly not true as a rule.
If the present = problem is merely terminological, as it seems to be, then extensive knowled= ge is not needed -- we can either follow mathematical usage or insist on di= stinctions of some sort that usage does not., leaving context to decide.


From: Alex Rozenshteyn <rpglover64@gmail.com>
To:<= /span> lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, June 18, 2011 10:44:14 AM
Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Category theory in lojb= an, or coining words

mu'i lo su'u kucli ku da xu .e ma vu'o poi ke'a se mriste ti curve bo cmaci= certu zmadu be mi

Out of curiosity, is anyone on this list more exp= erienced in pure math (pardon the malgli) than I am?

On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 5:50 AM, Escape Land= some <escaaape@gma= il.com> wrote:
coi

What this suggests me is that some inheritance mechanism is necessary.

For instance, one can argue that addition in the case of natural
numbers is a particular case of concatenation for sequences of the
same unit "I".

(i.e.:  III & IIII =3D IIIIIII captures the meaning of 3 + 4 =3D 7= , yet
concatenation is more general than addition, for IIJ & JJII =3D IIJJJII=
has no equivalent in the natural integers set)

So, if there were a word for "concatenation", say this is the word C,
it should bear some relation with the word for "integer addition", say
it is the word A.

C ---> A

For the same reason, "integer addition" should bear a strong
relationship with real addition, or complex addition.

Natural languages resolve this problem by using the word "sum" for all
additions, and by coining usages of "con-caten-ation", or ' other
types of "sums" ' for the other cases...

Regards

-- .esk

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--
          Alex R

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