From lojban+bncCMHEmaCOBhCRgePwBBoE0w4BMw@googlegroups.com Sat Jul 09 13:57:09 2011 Received: from mail-yx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.213.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QfeaC-0003O7-Nf; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:57:08 -0700 Received: by yxj20 with SMTP id 20sf3000987yxj.16 for ; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=zZIIPmumLAD02TURW42MgiEaHHvlRafAV2+Vje3nw3w=; b=D790FTetMFMtS63cm77e8Z5FV2aLT7Vd5yVb9avAs9gQ9Q+eYXQy2Oz6Po8khtawH0 vE53e4tao4PXq3IoSHdTts6cIvhw0WImv8omI0G5wqjne+wWi3TtgjHUyj+yWZGWce3P oydjFIfHR0xpHA+7V4v/FknHsPIZI0QME1FoQ= Received: by 10.91.78.19 with SMTP id f19mr492258agl.47.1310245009730; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:49 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.185.5 with SMTP id cm5ls225357ibb.3.gmail; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.179.134 with SMTP id bq6mr483981icb.40.1310245009041; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.179.134 with SMTP id bq6mr483980icb.40.1310245009002; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iw0-f170.google.com (mail-iw0-f170.google.com [209.85.214.170]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id c14si4558854icn.7.2011.07.09.13.56.48 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:48 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.170 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.170; Received: by iwn36 with SMTP id 36so3040659iwn.15 for ; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.43.46.6 with SMTP id um6mr3680778icb.204.1310245008475; Sat, 09 Jul 2011 13:56:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.176.11 with HTTP; Sat, 9 Jul 2011 13:56:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.176.11 with HTTP; Sat, 9 Jul 2011 13:56:48 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <201107090028.31171.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Sat, 9 Jul 2011 14:56:48 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: xu dai From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.170 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec5299e694c85a704a7a930c9 --bcaec5299e694c85a704a7a930c9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I suppose not, however, {mi me lo klama be lo zarci} means "I am something that goes to a store", not "I go to a store", which is what {mi klama lo zarci} means. to pu benji ti fo lo mi me la.android. fonxa toi mu'o mi'e.aionys. On Jul 9, 2011 2:21 PM, "Luke Bergen" wrote: > > But is it? > > In "lo broda be ko'a" we know from broda what "be ko'a" means. Does the "broda" of "lo broda" really lose all of it's x2/x3/xn values? > > On Jul 9, 2011 4:15 PM, "Jonathan Jones" wrote: > > No, it means less. > > > > That's why I used integral/derivative. The integral of the derivative of > > 2x^2+3x+5 is 2x^2+3x+C. some information is lost in the process. > > > > me lo broda is "x1 is amongst those that are broda in aspect x2", which is > > less meaningful. > > > > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Luke Bergen wrote: > > > >> It was an analogy. Don't take it as my cornerstone proof. > >> > >> If "me" means more than just the counterpart of "lo" then my bad. But I've > >> always thought of "me" as being as generic as "lo" is. Meh, if "me" means > >> more than the inverse of "lo" then I guess I've learned something today. > >> Though I'd like to hear it from vlasisku or one of the jbocrecevni first > >> On Jul 9, 2011 3:48 PM, "Jonathan Jones" wrote: > >> > It's more akin to the integral of the derivative of a function, than it > >> is > >> > to the negative of the negative of a function. > >> > > >> > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:43 PM, Jonathan Jones > >> wrote: > >> > > >> >> me = "amongst those that are" > >> >> lo cadzu = "something that walks" > >> >> > >> >> mi me lo cadzu = "I am amongst those that are something which walks" = > >> "I > >> >> am a walker" > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Luke Bergen > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> Not so sure I agree. "me" takes a sumti and turns it into a selbri. > >> "lo" > >> >>> takes a selbri and turns it into a sumti. > >> >>> > >> >>> -(-x) is not "a kind of negative-ish x". It's just positive x. Period > >> >>> On Jul 9, 2011 3:36 PM, "Jonathan Jones" wrote: > >> >>> > mi cadzu = "I walk" > >> >>> > mi me lo cadzu = "I am a walker (pedestrian)" > >> >>> > > >> >>> > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:17 PM, ianek wrote: > >> >>> > > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> On Jul 9, 1:17 pm, tijlan wrote: > >> >>> >> > As for "Is it the general feeling that I'm the one who go?", I > >> would > >> >>> >> > more consider "ka'u pei mi klama" or precisely "xu kampu fa lo ka > >> >>> >> > sidbo fa lo nu mi me lo klama". > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> I think i saw a {me lo}! > >> >>> >> Yes, I did! I did saw a {me lo}! > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> How is {me lo broda} different in meaning from {broda}? (other than > >> >>> >> {me lo} sort of cuts x2, x3 etc.) > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> mu'o mi'e ianek > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> -- > >> >>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> >>> Groups > >> >>> >> "lojban" group. > >> >>> >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>> >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> >> For more options, visit this group at > >> >>> >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > >> >>> >> > >> >>> >> > >> >>> > > >> >>> > > >> >>> > -- > >> >>> > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > >> >>> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > >> >>> > > >> >>> > -- > >> >>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> >>> Groups "lojban" group. > >> >>> > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> > For more options, visit this group at > >> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > >> >>> -- > >> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> Groups > >> >>> "lojban" group. > >> >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > >> >>> For more options, visit this group at > >> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> mu'o mi'e .aionys. > >> >> > >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > >> >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > >> >> > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > >> > > >> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > >> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >> "lojban" group. > >> > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > >> > > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >> "lojban" group. > >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > >> For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > > > > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. > > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --bcaec5299e694c85a704a7a930c9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I suppose not, however, {mi me lo klama be lo zarci} means "I am so= mething that goes to a store", not "I go to a store", which = is what {mi klama lo zarci} means.

to pu benji ti fo lo mi me la.android. fonxa toi
mu'o mi'e.aionys.
On Jul 9, 2011 2:21 PM, "Luke Bergen" <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> But is it?
>
> In "lo broda be ko'a" we know from broda what "be k= o'a" means.=A0 Does the "broda" of "lo broda" = really lose all of it's x2/x3/xn values?
>
> On Jul 9, 2011 4:15 PM, "Jonathan Jones" <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> > No, it means less.
> >
> > That's why I used integral/derivative. The integral of the de= rivative of
> > 2x^2+3x+5 is 2x^2+3x+C. some information is lost in the process.<= br> > >
> > me lo broda is "x1 is amongst those that are broda in aspect= x2", which is
> > less meaningful.
> >
> > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> It was an analogy. Don't take it as my cornerstone proof.=
> >>
> >> If "me" means more than just the counterpart of &qu= ot;lo" then my bad. But I've
> >> always thought of "me" as being as generic as "= ;lo" is. Meh, if "me" means
> >> more than the inverse of "lo" then I guess I've= learned something today.
> >> Though I'd like to hear it from vlasisku or one of the jb= ocrecevni first
> >> On Jul 9, 2011 3:48 PM, "Jonathan Jones" <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > It's more akin to the integral of the derivative of = a function, than it
> >> is
> >> > to the negative of the negative of a function.
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:43 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> me =3D "amongst those that are"
> >> >> lo cadzu =3D "something that walks"
> >> >>
> >> >> mi me lo cadzu =3D "I am amongst those that are= something which walks" =3D
> >> "I
> >> >> am a walker"
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> Not so sure I agree. "me" takes a sumt= i and turns it into a selbri.
> >> "lo"
> >> >>> takes a selbri and turns it into a sumti.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> -(-x) is not "a kind of negative-ish x"= ;. It's just positive x. Period
> >> >>> On Jul 9, 2011 3:36 PM, "Jonathan Jones&quo= t; <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote= :
> >> >>> > mi cadzu =3D "I walk"
> >> >>> > mi me lo cadzu =3D "I am a walker (ped= estrian)"
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 1:17 PM, ianek <<= a href=3D"mailto:janek37@gmail.com">janek37@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >> On Jul 9, 1:17 pm, tijlan <jbotij...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>> >> > As for "Is it the general fee= ling that I'm the one who go?", I
> >> would
> >> >>> >> > more consider "ka'u pei m= i klama" or precisely "xu kampu fa lo ka
> >> >>> >> > sidbo fa lo nu mi me lo klama"= ;.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >> I think i saw a {me lo}!
> >> >>> >> Yes, I did! I did saw a {me lo}!
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >> How is {me lo broda} different in meani= ng from {broda}? (other than
> >> >>> >> {me lo} sort of cuts x2, x3 etc.)
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >> mu'o mi'e ianek
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >> --
> >> >>> >> You received this message because you a= re subscribed to the Google
> >> >>> Groups
> >> >>> >> "lojban" group.
> >> >>> >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send em= ail to
> >> >>> >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> >> For more options, visit this group at > >> >>> >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >>
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > --
> >> >>> > mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu= .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
> >> >>> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your fath= er. :D )
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > --
> >> >>> > You received this message because you are s= ubscribed to the Google
> >> >>> Groups "lojban" group.
> >> >>> > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email = to
> >> >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> > For more options, visit this group at
> >> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >>> --
> >> >>> You received this message because you are subscr= ibed to the Google
> >> Groups
> >> >>> "lojban" group.
> >> >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >> >>> For more options, visit this group at
> >> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
> >> >>>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> >> >>
> >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
> >> >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )<= br> > >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> >> >
> >> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. = mi patfu do zo'o
> >> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to = the Google Groups
> >> "lojban" group.
> >> > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> >> lojb= an+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >> > For more options, visit this group at
> >> htt= p://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
> >> >
> >>
> >> --
> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the G= oogle Groups
> >> "lojban" group.
> >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> >> lojb= an+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >> For more options, visit this group at
> >> htt= p://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> >
> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu = do zo'o
> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Googl= e Groups "lojban" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3De= n.
> >
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Gro= ups "lojban" group.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den= .

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