From lojban+bncCISKx7CGAhCRlr3wBBoEasEN9Q@googlegroups.com Sat Jul 02 09:45:20 2011 Received: from mail-wy0-f189.google.com ([74.125.82.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Qd3Jl-00067G-DF; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 09:45:20 -0700 Received: by wyh13 with SMTP id 13sf7274527wyh.16 for ; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 09:45:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:reply-to:in-reply-to :references:from:date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=mw9SuQ55q0EkIFTZ/OILSz9KlKc9E6f8YHX6qyDkzZ4=; b=3JvDxxtQJGEi3wsgY27LQ8j4zneZpdPNegtkBWdt8HWD/jDYbzcBb6LmITqYFjHvqD n6M+fcNaGB2c4Ky+MF9dz538ZufB6BASTWmXOf2MDiEoiDslI+BfZb118lgTXoB4wimC pTy0OEMDJ1Z9oFnw1LXeH8Bh1L1SMK0hTYxeo= Received: by 10.216.231.83 with SMTP id k61mr867999weq.18.1309625105695; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 09:45:05 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.227.106.37 with SMTP id v37ls2061503wbo.1.gmail; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 09:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.169.72 with SMTP id m50mr254387wel.3.1309625104881; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 09:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.254.135 with SMTP id h7mswes; Sat, 2 Jul 2011 01:08:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.65.144 with SMTP id j16mr385651bki.14.1309594100208; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 01:08:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.65.144 with SMTP id j16mr385650bki.14.1309594100191; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 01:08:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-fx0-f43.google.com (mail-fx0-f43.google.com [209.85.161.43]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id q27si1178495fab.2.2011.07.02.01.08.20 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 02 Jul 2011 01:08:20 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of boldsirrobin@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.43 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.161.43; Received: by mail-fx0-f43.google.com with SMTP id 17so3509999fxg.2 for ; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 01:08:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.223.87.69 with SMTP id v5mr6206616fal.147.1309594099077; Sat, 02 Jul 2011 01:08:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.76.89 with HTTP; Sat, 2 Jul 2011 01:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com In-Reply-To: References: <20110702023512.GF8547@digitalkingdom.org> <20110702061357.GH8547@digitalkingdom.org> From: Robin Turner Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2011 11:07:58 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Is it a lie? To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: boldsirrobin@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of boldsirrobin@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.43 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=boldsirrobin@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A false statement is not necessarily a lie; what makes it a lie is the intent to deceive. ("Lie" is almost as celebrated a case in semantics as "bachelor".) So no word could make something a lie or not, unless we have a (self-defeating) attitudinal that says "lying" ;-) robin.tr On 2 July 2011 09:16, Jonathan Jones wrote: > Well, lying is deceptive, but it's not necessarily asshole-ish. :D > > to pu benji di'u fo lo mi me la.android. fonxa toi > > mu'o mi'e.aionys. > > On Jul 2, 2011 12:13 AM, "Robin Lee Powell" > wrote: > > I don't see a significant distinction between "you are lying" and > "you are being a deceptive asshole". > > -Robin > > On Sat, Jul 02, 2011 at 01:59:30AM -0400, Alex Rozenshteyn wrote: >> That feels like a slippery slop... > > -- > > http://singinst.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future. > Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/):... > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=3Den. > --=20 "Mix a little foolishness with your serious plans; it is lovely to be silly at the right moment." - Horace Robin Turner IDMYO Bilkent =DCniversitesi Ankara, Turkey http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~robin http://solri.livejournal.com --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.