From lojban+bncCNf8pM-bDBDhgIvxBBoEcOauAQ@googlegroups.com Sun Jul 17 03:58:53 2011 Received: from mail-qy0-f189.google.com ([209.85.216.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QiP3k-0003wu-13; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:53 -0700 Received: by qyk31 with SMTP id 31sf2719720qyk.16 for ; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=bZo0s8/w4nDcgoZ5ibI8gakcqx2Z4mPnQUw7gimDOxQ=; b=Ncr34AcwXz33buyrMdyjyPkxfM95iYQHqDDZhJJf3g7s7qzlkxLnjFQe55Zw5I9N9K 3zarmUwQlipRvVIjPfPflFSvjxnH2x3eYNoZ6hcj+BnlrZVJoarPPhZZaHnIOk+NdkmT 2xLOSJ4Hy10EOGPFfSRTuWIsTSsdhnK+WhVY4= Received: by 10.224.199.9 with SMTP id eq9mr686394qab.50.1310900321228; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:41 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.224.181.73 with SMTP id bx9ls407370qab.6.gmail; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.186.80 with SMTP id cr16mr5582429qab.11.1310900320592; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.186.80 with SMTP id cr16mr5582428qab.11.1310900320582; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qy0-f177.google.com (mail-qy0-f177.google.com [209.85.216.177]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ix17si2612803qcb.3.2011.07.17.03.58.40 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of paskios@gmail.com designates 209.85.216.177 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.216.177; Received: by qyk7 with SMTP id 7so1379621qyk.15 for ; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.16.143 with SMTP id o15mr1235513qca.203.1310900320397; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.229.189.5 with HTTP; Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:58:40 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 11:58:40 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] girzu gi'i gunma gi'i se gunma From: tijlan To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: paskios@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of paskios@gmail.com designates 209.85.216.177 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=paskios@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 2011/7/16 Jorge Llamb=EDas : > "lo" covers the non-distributive sense of "loi" (i.e. "lo" allows both di= stributive and non-distributive). Does "non-distributive" mean "collective"? > I have used "fa'u", and sometimes I have missed a corresponding gadri for= it. You also mentioned the following possibility in another discussion: ko'a fa'u ko'e fa'u ko'i xabju fo'a fa'u fo'e fa'u fo'i --> lo'au ci prenu cu xabju lo'au ci zdani ("lo'au" as a hypothetical fa'u-gadri) The BPFK defines "fa'u" as: "Respectively. Joins two sumti into one sumti. The referents of the resulting sumti are the referents of both sumti considered jointly and distributively in correspondence with another term." Would you say this is an ordered version of "jo'u": "jo'u + ce'o"? And, considering your following comment, > When I use "ce'o", I don't think of it as creating a reference to an orde= red set, but rather as indicating that the order of connectands is relevant= . > But "ko'a ce'o ko'e" still refers to ko'a and ko'e, not to something that= has them as members. could the non-set "fa'u" and the non-set "ce'o" have the same function when used for structurally corresponding pairs of terms: ko'a fa'u ko'e xabju fo'a fa'u fo'e ko'a ce'o ko'e xabju fo'a ce'o fo'e mu'o mi'e tijlan --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.