From lojban+bncCMGclZyxExCXocbxBBoEW7cXbA@googlegroups.com Thu Jul 28 09:39:00 2011 Received: from mail-qw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.216.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QmTbt-0005Hi-D8; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:59 -0700 Received: by qwh5 with SMTP id 5sf2847065qwh.16 for ; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=22n86Acvh0Pvggh/S4KcrK4jrCp2lOxgxxVmktQC0Aw=; b=6YrQxqt7IoowUkkZegQ59+qwHgmKdOsb6898HdbcatRCRQW7VEEsaP2uNT8ctqgx6O PR0gZl+02g9J5eCyD0qUDdc29nTwUVIvFoVSLOk8SyGdq8jjcT1Ak7Ge8Xnso6bfpAQD MflZMnVb36ALZrK4ZFDq6CV6V4wH/6LP3FPXU= Received: by 10.224.209.132 with SMTP id gg4mr57918qab.42.1311871127163; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:47 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.224.201.202 with SMTP id fb10ls5339504qab.2.gmail; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.195.9 with SMTP id ea9mr183953qab.27.1311871126434; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.224.195.9 with SMTP id ea9mr183951qab.27.1311871126422; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vx0-f175.google.com ([209.85.220.175]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id gz6si989561qcb.3.2011.07.28.09.38.46 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.175 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.220.175; Received: by vxh2 with SMTP id 2so2286740vxh.6 for ; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.25.46 with SMTP id z14mr226816vdf.464.1311871126147; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.52.186.231 with HTTP; Thu, 28 Jul 2011 09:38:46 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1311870454.18589.YahooMailRC@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <201107191408.50207.phma@phma.optus.nu> <1311780839.58357.YahooMailRC@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1311870454.18589.YahooMailRC@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2011 18:38:46 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Gerunds, infinitives and other technicalities From: Escape Landsome To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: escaaape@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of escaaape@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.175 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=escaaape@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The point is no concept is ontologically pure (and this should be a problem, even in Lojban). Assume we are talking of "reading a book", for instance. Reading a book would be : 1=B0) the process of collect the information of adjacent letters and words in lines of the pages of the book, 2=B0) the same process, but with the correlative cognitive process of assigning a meaning (i.e. mental images) to what is pronounced 3=B0) the overall and more global process of entering deeply in the author thought, in his world, and capture subtleties 4=B0) the same process acted on a whole life, so as to change one's philosophy (as when you say "I am a Gospel reader") There IS some connection between all four meanings, in the sense that 4=B0) needs 3=B0) which is necessary for 2=B0) to be carried, which in turn is necessary for 1=B0) Or, you could say, 1=B0) is a substratum of 2=B0), which is one of 3=B0), which is one of 4=B0), and there is pragmatic elaboration from 1=B0) to 4=B0) I guess that a PERFECT lojbanist would create four sumti for each meaning..= . But the real problem is that these meanings lie in a CONTINUUM. So, in fact, one would ideally need an infinite number of sumti, if one would render each meaning subtlety... Here, I have a similar problem : what I speak about is a quest about the meaning of life or the like (you got it), but it is ALSO a specific question, the question that carries within itself this quest. This notion is a lojbanic monster, because it should be two broda at the same time, if we were to use existing broda Thus, I guess the best thing to do is to create a neologism to encapsulate the very special meaning of this (somewhat ?) "new" notion... Or, perhaps, you have a better idea ? I'm ready for all suggestions --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.