From lojban+bncCOjSjrXVGBCshPPxBBoEAMTx0g@googlegroups.com Fri Aug 05 21:25:44 2011 Received: from mail-ww0-f61.google.com ([74.125.82.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1QpYRz-0002HB-Rh; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:44 -0700 Received: by wwf4 with SMTP id 4sf2259999wwf.16 for ; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=/fyVns/MmaNumF0i4lFNwYmmCrybFCQZyHAsx2+Jl10=; b=BK/0b9Yc+XFAgul4UYrRcEl55HTMFp79SRBuBNcjtv28rRHNl77+/6pStSo/dWghwB cFKlK0J1fPodZTnHIKSJgOyTzm4+IldPi/w84UoWZQJJpHntJZIxNPgyGyjqF+/WmE0c qCsUN4GGwox+37WXsl31ULQ7CUZ1AJwxE+/gg= Received: by 10.216.25.129 with SMTP id z1mr38086wez.10.1312604716270; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:16 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.216.207.136 with SMTP id n8ls10610233weo.0.gmail; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.186.197 with SMTP id w47mr48872wem.7.1312604715344; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.186.197 with SMTP id w47mr48871wem.7.1312604715305; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wy0-f169.google.com (mail-wy0-f169.google.com [74.125.82.169]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id fm12si1042149wbb.3.2011.08.05.21.25.15 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.169 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.82.169; Received: by wyi11 with SMTP id 11so57018wyi.0 for ; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.1.200 with SMTP id 50mr1421861wed.33.1312604715080; Fri, 05 Aug 2011 21:25:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.26.65 with HTTP; Fri, 5 Aug 2011 21:24:55 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Luke Bergen Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2011 00:24:55 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Klingon proverbs in Lojban To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of lukeabergen@gmail.com designates 74.125.82.169 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=lukeabergen@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016364d2c79c5dd4304a9ce992f --0016364d2c79c5dd4304a9ce992f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I didn't think what you said was even grammatical. {nu} takes a bridi and turns it into a selbri. I believe TAG expects a sumti which is why it's always {TAG lo nu}. At least, jboski seems to choke when it gets to {nu} On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 12:16 AM, MorphemeAddict wrote: > Okay, that makes sense. I didn't think of {ca lo nu ...}. Is there a > difference in meaning, or is it 'just' a structural difference? It seems > like the difference between, e.g., "during their dying", vs. "while they're > dying". > > stevo > > On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Luke Bergen wrote: > >> since po'o is a UI it modifies the preceding word so wouldn't you want {lo >> bebna po'o cu cmila ca [lo?] nu lo damba cu mrobi'o}? >> >> >> On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 3:08 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: >> >>> I've been using "fa" to imitate the OVS structure of Klingon, but I think >>> it's better to use an unmarked form of Lojban instead. >>> >>> po'o lo bebna cu cmila ca nu lo damba cu mrobi'o >>> >>> stevo >>> >>> On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 2:33 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: >>> >>>> Hagh qoHpu' neH HeghtaHvIS SuvwI'pu' >>>> Only fools laugh while warriors die. >>>> >>>> cmila fa po'o lo bebna ca nu mrobi'o fa lo damba >>>> >>>> stevo >>>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 10:16 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: >>>> >>>>> No, none of those is a replacement proverb. >>>>> In Klingon circles, a 'replacement proverb' (qa'meH vIttlhegh) is >>>>> uttered by a person immediately after he feels he has lost honor, e.g., by >>>>> committing a gaff in public, and thus attempts to regain his honor. >>>>> >>>>> Examples from "Power Klingon", an audio cassette by Marc Okrand, >>>>> include: >>>>> >>>>> DopDaq qul yIchenmoH QobDI' ghu' >>>>> Set fire on the side when there is danger. >>>>> >>>>> reH Suvrup SuvwI''a' >>>>> A great warrior is always prepared. >>>>> >>>>> Hagh qoHpu' neH HeghtaHvIS SuvwI'pu' >>>>> Only fools laugh while warriors die. >>>>> >>>>> HIvqa' veqlargh >>>>> The Fek'lhr strikes again. >>>>> >>>>> The replacement proverbs are basically interchangeable; any one can be >>>>> used on any occasion when it is felt necessary. The literal meanings are >>>>> also completely irrelevant. Replacement proverbs are similar to apologies in >>>>> other cultures. >>>>> >>>>> stevo >>>>> (aka lay'tel SIvten) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 2:45 PM, Luke Bergen wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> hmm, I assume that by "Klingong replacement proverbs" you mean (for >>>>>> example) some of the entires here: >>>>>> http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Klingon_proverbs >>>>>> >>>>>> lo ba'e bajra nanmu cu kakne lo nu ka'argau lo voki'o galxe ze'i lo pa >>>>>> nicte >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 1:18 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Just a thought. >>>>>>> Translate Klingon replacement proverbs into Lojban. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Curiouser and curiouser. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> stevo >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "lojban" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "lojban" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "lojban" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --0016364d2c79c5dd4304a9ce992f Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I didn't think what you said was even grammatical.

{= nu} takes a bridi and turns it into a selbri. =A0I believe TAG expects a su= mti which is why it's always {TAG lo nu}. =A0At least, jboski seems to = choke when it gets to {nu}

On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 12:16= AM, MorphemeAddict <lytlesw@gmail.com> wrote:
Okay, that makes sense. I didn't think of {ca lo nu ...}. Is there= a difference in meaning, or is it 'just' a structural difference? = It seems like the difference between, e.g., "during their dying",= vs. "while they're dying".
=A0
stevo

On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
since po'o is a UI it modifies th= e preceding word so wouldn't you want {lo bebna po'o cu cmila ca [l= o?] nu lo damba cu mrobi'o}?=20


On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 3:08 PM, MorphemeAddict <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lytlesw@gmail.com> wrote:
I've been using "fa" to imitate the OVS structure of Kli= ngon, but I think it's better to use an unmarked form of Lojban instead= .
=A0
po'o lo bebna cu cmila ca nu lo damba cu mrobi'o
=A0
stevo

On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 2:33 PM, MorphemeAddict <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lytlesw@gmail.com> wrote:
Hagh qoHpu' neH HeghtaHvIS Su= vwI'pu'
Only fools laugh while warriors d= ie.

cmila fa po'o lo bebna ca nu mrobi'o fa lo damba
=A0
stevo

On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 10:16 PM, MorphemeAddict = <lytlesw@gmail.com> wrote:
No, none of those is a replacement proverb.
In Klingon circles, a 'replacement proverb' (qa'meH vIttlh= egh) is uttered by a person immediately after he feels he has lost honor, e= .g., by committing a gaff in public, and thus attempts to regain his honor.=
=A0
Examples from "Power Klingon", an audio cassette by Marc Okr= and, include:
=A0
DopDaq qul yIchenmoH QobDI' g= hu'
Set fire on the side when there i= s danger.
=A0
reH Suvrup SuvwI''a' =
A great warrior is always prepare= d.
=A0
Hagh qoHpu' neH HeghtaHvIS Su= vwI'pu'
Only fools laugh while warriors d= ie.

HIvqa' veqlargh
= The Fek'lhr strikes again.
=A0
The replacement proverbs are basically interchangeable; any one can be= used on any occasion when it is felt necessary. The literal meanings are a= lso completely irrelevant. Replacement proverbs are similar to apologies in= other cultures.
=A0
stevo
(aka lay'tel SIvten)

=A0
On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 2:45 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
hmm, I assume that by "Klingong = replacement proverbs" you mean (for example) some of the entires here:= =A0http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Klingon_proverbs=20

lo ba'e bajra nanmu cu kakne lo nu ka'argau lo voki'o galx= e=A0ze'i lo pa nicte


On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 1:18 PM, MorphemeAddict <<= a href=3D"mailto:lytlesw@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">lytlesw@gmail.com= > wrote:
Just a thought.
Translate Klingon replacement proverbs into Lojban.
=A0
Curiouser and curiouser.
=A0
stevo

--
You received this message because you are subs= cribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this gr= oup, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.= com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the G= oogle Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email= to lojban@goo= glegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.= com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.



--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the G= oogle Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email= to lojban@goo= glegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.= com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the G= oogle Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email= to lojban@goo= glegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.= com/group/lojban?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojba= n?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.
--0016364d2c79c5dd4304a9ce992f--