From lojban+bncCMHEmaCOBhDu1ILyBBoEPxDN3Q@googlegroups.com Mon Aug 08 20:33:30 2011 Received: from mail-gx0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Qqd45-0000vo-TF; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:29 -0700 Received: by gxk3 with SMTP id 3sf4115276gxk.16 for ; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=rbHThdeLORML8rHhpzZ2h2vt6L4HOU1ZZ+iE3bNxID0=; b=WtKG09Qn1T/SvzigO7PtKcDuPUnDYyoN0HSc6aSpmeOxcIteyMFkKol0pS928g7ORT zw6TMZ6rBg+RE52ou/PMUhDGz/4dpVnLDSsb+V2v3A1HW1lslbvb6x2wH1YCRLypqOO7 ZqlxF8EBYSq+ZdsFNyoEZxRdeMGxagovElgXc= Received: by 10.101.154.5 with SMTP id g5mr1032751ano.26.1312860782828; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.231.224.87 with SMTP id in23ls3808217ibb.7.gmail; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.171.71 with SMTP id i7mr669211icz.24.1312860782152; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.42.171.71 with SMTP id i7mr669210icz.24.1312860782135; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-iy0-f173.google.com (mail-iy0-f173.google.com [209.85.210.173]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id y7si2205738icw.0.2011.08.08.20.33.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.210.173 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.210.173; Received: by mail-iy0-f173.google.com with SMTP id 2so9683529iyk.18 for ; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.43.50.132 with SMTP id ve4mr6306895icb.152.1312860781629; Mon, 08 Aug 2011 20:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.176.68 with HTTP; Mon, 8 Aug 2011 20:33:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <201108050747.17647.phma@phma.optus.nu> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 21:33:01 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Klingon proverbs in Lojban From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.210.173 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1004133512417 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec5299f5d87507d04aa0a3844 --bcaec5299f5d87507d04aa0a3844 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 If I understand ze'ei correctly, then {zo'e ze'ei pa} means, basically, "unspecified number", or, in other words, "anything of selma'o PA", which means it includes numbers <=1, irrational numbers, imaginary numbers, etc. Since something must happen more than once to happen "again", {za'u xo'e re'u to zo xo'e selsmu lu zo'e ze'ei pa li'u toi} does not have the same meaning. When something happens for the 2nd time {re re'u}, it is happening again. When something happens for the 3rd time {ci re'u}, it is happening again. When something happens for the 4th time {vo re'u}, it is happening again. ... When something happens for the (x>1)th time {za'u [pa] re'u}, it is happening again. On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 8:14 PM, Ian Johnson wrote: > If the default number were to be made {xo'e} (which has been proposed to > mean {zo'e ze'ei pa}, especially now that its current meaning is useless > with xorlo in place) instead of {pa}, then {za'u re'u} would be implicitly > {za'u xo'e re'u}, which would definitely work for "again", I think. > > mu'o mi'e latros > > > On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 12:16 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: > >> >> >> On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 7:47 AM, Pierre Abbat wrote: >> >>> On Friday 05 August 2011 01:43:04 MorphemeAddict wrote: >>> > gunta fa la veklarg >>> > >>> > I don't know how to say "again" ('x+1'th occurrence?). >>> >>> za'ure'u - that's what it was in Alice. >>> >>> Pierre >>> >> Does "za'u re'u" already contain the idea of 'time' or 'occurrence'? It >> seems to be just an ordinal number meaning 'further', 'additional'. >> >> Does this work: >> za'u re'u gunta fa la veklarg >> >> I also found "krefu", but I don't know if/how "krefu" can be used to get >> the meaning of 'again'. >> >> stevo >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "lojban" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "lojban" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en. --bcaec5299f5d87507d04aa0a3844 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If I understand ze'ei correctly, then {zo'e ze'ei pa} means, ba= sically, "unspecified number", or, in other words, "anything= of selma'o PA", which means it includes numbers <=3D1, irratio= nal numbers, imaginary numbers, etc. Since something must happen more than = once to happen "again", {za'u xo'e re'u to zo xo'= e selsmu lu zo'e ze'ei pa li'u toi} does not have the same mean= ing.

When something happens for the 2nd time {re re'u}, it is happening = again.
When something happens for the 3rd time {ci re'u}, it is happ= ening again.
When something happens for the 4th time {vo re'u}, it is happening agai= n.
...
When something happens for the (x>1)th time {za'u [pa] re'= ;u}, it is happening again.


On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 8:14 PM, Ian John= son <blindbr= avado@gmail.com> wrote:
If the default number were to be made {xo'e} (which has been proposed t= o mean {zo'e ze'ei pa}, especially now that its current meaning is = useless with xorlo in place) instead of {pa}, then {za'u re'u} woul= d be implicitly {za'u xo'e re'u}, which would definitely work f= or "again", I think.

mu'o mi'e latros


On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 12:16 PM, MorphemeAddict <lyt= lesw@gmail.com> wrote:


On Fri, Aug 5, 2011 at 7:47 AM, Pierre Abba= t <phma@phma.optus.nu> wrote:
On Friday 05 August 2011 01:43:04 MorphemeAddict wrote:
> gunta = fa la veklarg
>
> I don't know how to say "again"= ('x+1'th occurrence?).

za'ure'u - that's = what it was in Alice.

Pierre
Does "za'u re'u" already contain the idea of &= #39;time' or 'occurrence'? It seems to be just an ordinal numbe= r meaning 'further', 'additional'.
=A0
Does this work:
za'u re'u gunta fa la veklarg
=A0
I also found "krefu", but I don't know if/how "kref= u" can be used to get the meaning of 'again'.
=A0
stevo

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--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

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