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[100.33.73.219]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id l7sm687469qaz.15.2015.02.11.05.01.30 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:01:31 -0800 (PST) From: Riley Martinez-Lynch Message-Id: <5A14A249-2461-4CA7-8CBA-4E27840BB4F3@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.6 \(1510\)) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 08:01:29 -0500 References: <54D471BB.2070605@lojban.org> <54D66BA8.5040607@lojban.org> <08041A2E-FC72-4E80-AAB4-468A1A3C4DB4@gmail.com> <54DA533B.2090803@lojban.org> To: llg-members@lojban.org In-Reply-To: <54DA533B.2090803@lojban.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510) X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.7 X-Spam_score_int: 7 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "stodi.digitalkingdom.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: lojbab: > Since BPFK does exist, and is being renewed rather than newly created, it has a set of members, even if it isn't entirely clear who is in the set. selpahi: [...] Content analysis details: (0.7 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.7 DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL RBL: Envelope sender listed in dnsbl.ahbl.org [listed in gmail.com.rhsbl.ahbl.org. IN] [A] -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2 RBL: Average reputation (+2) [209.85.192.54 listed in wl.mailspike.net] -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (shunpiker[at]gmail.com) 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] -0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature -0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain 0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid Subject: [Llg-members] Motion: BPFK Reauthorization (amendment) X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18-1 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3843252149964468596==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============3843252149964468596== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_BCA5862C-6C2C-4F61-89C4-0CE7A0394132" --Apple-Mail=_BCA5862C-6C2C-4F61-89C4-0CE7A0394132 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii lojbab: > Since BPFK does exist, and is being renewed rather than newly created, = it has a set of members, even if it isn't entirely clear who is in the = set. selpahi: > For this I would like to suggest that upon formation of the new BPFK, = all previous/current members are removed, so the BPFK starts with an = empty set of members. Then, everyone who is interested in becoming a = member can speak up and will be able to become a member (with or without = having to meet certain criteria, depending on what we are going to = decide). This has the advantage of knowing who is actually a member, = which might come in handy if there are going to be votes, for instance. lojbab: > The only reasons I see to have some more rules on who is a member are = ... the immense and more or less exclusive power that is being granted = to BPFK to propose/produce language standards I agree that there is a sense that BPFK may have members, but that the = extent of membership is unclear. I also agree this is problematic from a = procedural perspective, as selpahi describes, and because of the powers = delegated to BPFK, as described by lojbab. To address these concerns, as well as to resolve any doubt about the = power of the chair to appoint members and/or determine procedures for = membership in the committee, I propose the following amendment: -- The chair is authorized to appoint members of BPFK who may or may not = also be members of LLG, to establish expectations for the participation = of members in committee work, to remove members who are unable or fail = to meet the expectations for participation, and to determine regular = procedures by which parties may be added or removed as members of the = committee. At the time of the adoption of this policy, and at any time that a chair = is elected by the membership of LLG without having been nominated to = that election by BPFK, any membership in BPFK will be deemed to lapse = and any membership-related procedure established within the committee = will be deemed to expire. The appointment of an interim chair will not = be held to cause any membership in BPFK to lapse, or to have any effect = upon BPFK membership procedures. -- I have attached the text of the motion as it would be amended below. I'd like to respond to some of the other issues raised, but will do so = in a separate message. Thanks, --Riley ---- Motion: BPFK REAUTHORIZATION (as amended) LLG hereby recommissions BPFK (a.k.a. "banpla fuzykamni", "baupla = fuzykamni", "byfy") as a standing committee with the charge of improving = and maintaining formal descriptions of Lojban, elaborating undocumented = and under-documented language features, resolving inconsistencies and = errors in existing documentation, and responding to issues that arise in = usage. BPFK is expressly empowered to determine its own decision-making process = and pursue its own agenda within the scope of its charge as specified in = this charter. BPFK is authorized to propose standards for the lojban language which = may include, but are not limited to, lists of words, definitions in = various languages, human or mechanical specifications of the grammar, = and instructional or reference texts. BPFK may develop standards = documents or recognize documents which have been developed by other = bodies or individuals. Standard documents may be reported to an Annual Meeting or Special = Meeting of the membership for ratification by a two-thirds majority of = the general membership. Once ratified, these may be described as = "official standards" of LLG. When an Annual Meeting or Special Meeting = of the membership is not in session, BPFK may seek Board approval of = standards, which upon such approval, may be described as "interim = standards". Upon adoption of this policy, the Annual Meeting of LLG membership will = hold an election for the office of chair of BPFK. Henceforth, BPFK may, = in its annual report to the membership, nominate a candidate to serve a = subsequent term as chair. If such a candidate is reported, LLG = membership will hold a vote of confidence requiring a simple majority to = confirm the nomination. If no candidate is nominated by BPFK, or if the = nominated candidate is not confirmed by the membership, an open election = will be held by LLG membership. At no time will membership in LLG or = BPFK be considered a requirement for the position of chair of BPFK. The natural term of the office of chair of BPFK will begin at the time = of the confirmation or election at the Annual Meeting and extend to the = confirmation or election of a chair at the subsequent Annual Meeting, or = to the adjournment of that meeting if no chair is elected or confirmed. = Should the chair become vacant for any reason while an Annual Meeting or = Special Meeting of the membership is not in session, the Board may ask = the committee to nominate an interim chair to serve the balance of the = term. Should the committee fail to forward a nominee, or should more = than one nominee be forwarded, the Board reserves the discretion to = appoint an interim chair. In the case that the Annual Meeting of LLG membership fails to confirm = or elect a chair, the committee will be considered suspended until such = a time as an interim chair is appointed by the Board, or until the = election of a new chair at a subsequent Annual Meeting or Special = Meeting of the membership. The chair is authorized to appoint members of BPFK who may or may not = also be members of LLG, to establish expectations for the participation = of members in committee work, to remove members who are unable or fail = to meet the expectations for participation, and to determine regular = procedures by which parties may be added or removed as members of the = committee. At the time of the adoption of this policy, and at any time that a chair = is elected by the membership of LLG without having been nominated to = that election by BPFK, any membership in BPFK will be deemed to lapse = and any membership-related procedure established within the committee = will be deemed to expire. The appointment of an interim chair will not = be held to cause any membership in BPFK to lapse, or to have any effect = upon BPFK membership procedures. In the case that policies specified in this document are found to = contradict policies previously established by LLG or its Board of = Directors, the policies in this document should be held to supplant the = previous policies.= --Apple-Mail=_BCA5862C-6C2C-4F61-89C4-0CE7A0394132 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Since BPFK does exist, and is being renewed rather = than newly created, it has a set of members, even if it isn't entirely = clear who is in the = set.

selpahi:

For this I would like to suggest that upon formation of = the new BPFK, all previous/current members are removed, so the BPFK = starts with an empty set of members. Then, everyone who is interested in = becoming a member can speak up and will be able to become a member (with = or without having to meet certain criteria, depending on what we are = going to decide). This has the advantage of knowing who is actually a = member, which might come in handy if there are going to be votes, for = instance.

lojbab:

=
The only reasons I see to have = some more rules on who is a member are ... the immense and more or = less exclusive power that is being granted to BPFK to propose/produce = language standards

I agree that = there is a sense that BPFK may have members, but that the extent of = membership is unclear. I also agree this is problematic from a = procedural perspective, as selpahi describes, and because of the powers = delegated to BPFK, as described by lojbab.

To = address these concerns, as well as to resolve any doubt about the power = of the chair to appoint members and/or determine procedures for = membership in the committee, I propose the following = amendment:

--
The chair is =
authorized to appoint members of BPFK who may or may not also be =
members of LLG, to establish expectations for the participation of =
members in committee work, to remove members who are unable or fail to =
meet the expectations for participation, and to determine regular =
procedures by which parties may be added or removed as members of the =
committee.
At the time of =
the adoption of this policy, and at any time that a chair is =
elected by the membership of LLG without having been nominated to that =
election by BPFK, any membership in BPFK will be deemed to lapse and any =
membership-related procedure established within the committee will be =
deemed to expire. The appointment of an interim chair will not be held =
to cause any membership in BPFK to lapse, or to have any effect upon =
BPFK membership =
procedures.
--

I have attached the text of the motion as it would be amended = below.

I'd like to respond to some of the other = issues raised, but will do so in a separate = message.

Thanks,

--Riley=

----

LLG hereby recommissions BPFK (a.k.a. = "banpla fuzykamni", "baupla fuzykamni", "byfy") as a standing committee = with the charge of improving and maintaining formal descriptions of = Lojban, elaborating undocumented and under-documented language features, = resolving inconsistencies and errors in existing documentation, and = responding to issues that arise in usage.
BPFK is expressly empowered to determine its own =
decision-making process and pursue its own agenda within the scope of =
its charge as specified in this charter.

BPFK is authorized to propose standards for the lojban language which =
may include, but are not limited to, lists of words, definitions in =
various languages, human or mechanical specifications of the grammar, =
and instructional or reference texts. BPFK may develop standards =
documents or recognize documents which have been developed by other =
bodies or individuals.

Standard documents may be reported to an Annual Meeting or Special =
Meeting of the membership for ratification by a two-thirds majority of =
the general membership. Once ratified, these may be described as =
"official standards" of LLG. When an Annual Meeting or Special Meeting =
of the membership is not in session, BPFK may seek Board approval of =
standards, which upon such approval, may be described as "interim =
standards".

Upon adoption of this policy, the Annual Meeting of LLG membership will =
hold an election for the office of chair of BPFK. Henceforth, BPFK may, =
in its annual report to the membership, nominate a candidate to serve a =
subsequent term as chair. If such a candidate is reported, LLG =
membership will hold a vote of confidence requiring a simple majority to =
confirm the nomination. If no candidate is nominated by BPFK, or if the =
nominated candidate is not confirmed by the membership, an open election =
will be held by LLG membership. At no time will membership in LLG or =
BPFK be considered a requirement for the position of chair of BPFK.

The natural term of the office of chair of BPFK will begin at the time =
of the confirmation or election at the Annual Meeting and extend to the =
confirmation or election of a chair at the subsequent Annual Meeting, or =
to the adjournment of that meeting if no chair is elected or confirmed. =
Should the chair become vacant for any reason while an Annual Meeting or =
Special Meeting of the membership is not in session, the Board may ask =
the committee to nominate an interim chair to serve the balance of the =
term. Should the committee fail to forward a nominee, or should more =
than one nominee be forwarded, the Board reserves the discretion to =
appoint an interim chair.

In the case that the Annual Meeting of LLG membership fails to confirm =
or elect a chair, the committee will be considered suspended until such =
a time as an interim chair is appointed by the Board, or until the =
election of a new chair at a subsequent Annual Meeting or Special =
Meeting of the membership.
The chair is authorized to appoint members of BPFK who =
may or may not also be members of LLG, to establish expectations for the =
participation of members in committee work, to remove members who are =
unable or fail to meet the expectations for participation, and to =
determine regular procedures by which parties may be added or removed as =
members of the committee.
At =
the time of the adoption of this policy, and at any time that a =
chair is elected by the membership of LLG without having been =
nominated to that election by BPFK, any membership in BPFK will be =
deemed to lapse and any membership-related procedure established within =
the committee will be deemed to expire. The appointment of an interim =
chair will not be held to cause any membership in BPFK to lapse, or to =
have any effect upon BPFK membership procedures.
In the case that policies specified in =
this document are found to contradict policies previously established by =
LLG or its Board of Directors, the policies in this document should be =
held to supplant the previous policies.
= --Apple-Mail=_BCA5862C-6C2C-4F61-89C4-0CE7A0394132-- --===============3843252149964468596== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Llg-members mailing list Llg-members@lojban.org http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members --===============3843252149964468596==--