Received: from localhost ([::1]:57844 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1ecmAg-0002l9-6I; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:58:30 -0800 Received: from mail-vk0-f43.google.com ([209.85.213.43]:38640) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1ecmAA-0002jT-32 for llg-members@lojban.org; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:57:59 -0800 Received: by mail-vk0-f43.google.com with SMTP id z9so1986853vkd.5 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:57:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=XOvmneKiX2N4HV4LYf7q3DMMmsokdqMrLDiLaAkUWAY=; b=SHIAZktkF1WTGURx3RQ+3S664eXm4Pwj89dmU3nxVEZMmL3ATuAkvMHb9blMcuU65e Pe32hYR4MeiSWg6KR2S99BaEa1nsc5lZ8auNtf1PFy2ae3uRKNkr3hlUQrFl/0nBg0t8 uyCxmYdEWdowSsjKWTJLyUrGNP6T8YzvedWwX86IrWvcKM94kUXW2N2XD5i7aHp8hq7C sd8hHVW0z9vWMD4rwGBZBHfRrfgCrbDSLwjxKEm2do8NBGwzBqFX3ySRURjDdnqJfmHo hQqblPUf8lD6P1oDVQ+WKx8H/DHlvcZVR68iCeTsg2PYfqcuwUO0La+vAqG5QG1jXuZi uT0A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=XOvmneKiX2N4HV4LYf7q3DMMmsokdqMrLDiLaAkUWAY=; b=lckQAiBCTGff6VfmqUqvQ70EzUzKu+4Pc43raP6VRN4obr/YECt798OFnEVP3WIf5m nnjbwQCjr2rvBpbTTDELRZZzXM/ApGQJPIkpWgGJ+ypk/ZLDSi2hU3QwoUmYyvUvcdKJ N7euYTsayg2S9FkBOUZxDCUbacGlMtPDUzkbyFt33JRGPC87DrR7QPLQtP09MpJiUJnk ORrpzrbWpXkuT/FlaL1qYPevm38xtoFD+uzVIlnibfBZdhRz102+MZuVbpHFU3dEeXwI QENFWX55UZMMCmOtF8/M4qyDy1IG/OyTPhDYIX87yRxWu7zoCt/g89YBrlQARh91LJAO l+7g== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxytd5A4AfhOHFoMZWMwkMb5keaVxpAvPZKLsCft7nVMkw9hF1WMAI 3ijm9xldbxxgAUtvh8S/REA0br916k9shqdZzU0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x227BELVKD8vg2NlGyFLhG7o7diOcnpHjWCUl91YE0T37+dPK/ySLKvf/1kl+Ba9u4R2xaiqslxU9wA/Ni0Wu6/g= X-Received: by 10.31.184.139 with SMTP id i133mr527916vkf.6.1516427871403; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:57:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.159.63.12 with HTTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.159.63.12 with HTTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2018 21:57:50 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <4734149.Ac4Tda036i@caracal> <415C970B-FE34-45F4-85EA-58923A0489E0@gmail.com> From: Creative Care Services Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2018 00:57:50 -0500 Message-ID: To: llg-members@lojban.org X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.0 X-Spam_score_int: -9 X-Spam_bar: - Subject: Re: [Llg-members] Motion proposal - Unofficialness Disclaimer X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============6700100103896377176==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============6700100103896377176== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11441be69a457d05632ee02c" --001a11441be69a457d05632ee02c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was in the middle of composing a response when my incomplete email was mistakenly sent. On Jan 20, 2018 00:56, "Creative Care Services" wrote: > As Riley has said, there is much room to discuss how > > On Jan 19, 2018 19:24, "Riley Martinez-Lynch" wrote= : > >> I vote no on this motion, which I understand to be numbered as 5. >> >> I=E2=80=99d like to add that I would like to work on distinguishing the = official >> publications of LLG from content which is not official, and that I think >> that adding a disclaimer to web pages is not an adequate solution. As >> guskant has pointed out, there are other channels that someone who is no= t >> overly familiar with lojban or LLG might confuse with official organs of >> LLG. >> >> I get the firm impression that there is a consensus to address this >> issue, which is to say, while opinions vary about how grave the problem = is, >> I have yet to hear an argument that we should leave things exactly as th= ey >> are. I think that we can do better than formal resolutions that originat= e >> in the course of a confusing email discussion, and if I am wrong and we >> can=E2=80=99t, it=E2=80=99s possible to legislate later, once we underst= and why it=E2=80=99s >> necessary to do it that way. >> >> =E2=80=94Riley >> >> On Jan 17, 2018, at 4:52 PM, Adam Lopresto >> wrote: >> >> I vote Nay. >> >> On Sat, Jan 13, 2018 at 4:11 PM Creative Care Services < >> comcaresvcs@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I now open this topic to a vote on the following proposal: >>> >>> All non-official pages or content on *.lojban.org must contain a >>> disclaimer stating, at least, that the website is owned and managed by >>> voluntary >>> >>> people, and that the marked contents are not necessarily harmonized wit= h >>> the official design of Lojban and may not reflect, let alone perfectly >>> comply with, official specifications of the same. >>> >>> Voting will be closed no sooner than noon on January 16, 2018 GMT. >>> >>> On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 1:20 AM, Curtis Franks >> > wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On Jan 5, 2018 03:20, "Creative Care Services" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thank you, Pierre. >>>>> >>>>> We now have a motion on the floor that has been made and seconded. I >>>>> ask that all discussion of this motion, and only such discussion take= place >>>>> in this thread. As a point, since we have people in attendance who ar= e not >>>>> officially members I am making it clear that anyone can make comments= , post >>>>> ideas, respond to ideas and proposals, and ask questions. We apprecia= te >>>>> your interest. >>>>> >>>>> Discussion will be open until 12:00 noon GMT on January 9, 2018, or >>>>> until it appears to me that the discussion is no longer active before= then. >>>>> Other discussions will continue in other threads. Because my intent i= s to >>>>> complete this meeting fairly soon without having to push topics to th= e next >>>>> meeting just because of time I would like to carry out similar proces= ses in >>>>> parallel I ask for a ruling on the appropriatness of such action. >>>>> >>>>> Thank you. >>>>> >>>>> .karis. >>>>> >>>>> On Jan 5, 2018 02:11, "Pierre Abbat" wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, January 5, 2018 1:46:41 AM EST Creative Care Services wrot= e: >>>>> > Ok, with multiple seconds it is necessary to clarify which motion w= e >>>>> will >>>>> > be voting on and whether at least one second is specifically for th= at >>>>> > motion. >>>>> > >>>>> > I therefore am restating what the first motion was : >>>>> > >>>>> > Curtis moved that, " I move that: All non-official pages or content >>>>> on *. >>>>> > lojban.org must contain a disclaimer stating, at least, that the >>>>> website is >>>>> > owned and managed by voluntary people, and that the marked contents >>>>> are not >>>>> > necessarily harmonized with the official design of Lojban and may n= ot >>>>> > reflect, let alone perfectly comply with, official specifications o= f >>>>> the >>>>> > same." >>>>> > >>>>> > Is there a second for this only? >>>>> >>>>> I second this. >>>>> >>>>> Pierre >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> loi mintu se ckaji danlu cu jmaji >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Llg-members mailing list >>>>> Llg-members@lojban.org >>>>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Llg-members mailing list >>>>> Llg-members@lojban.org >>>>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Llg-members mailing list >>>> Llg-members@lojban.org >>>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Llg-members mailing list >>> Llg-members@lojban.org >>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Llg-members mailing list >> Llg-members@lojban.org >> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Llg-members mailing list >> Llg-members@lojban.org >> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >> >> --001a11441be69a457d05632ee02c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I was in the middle of composing a response when my incom= plete email was mistakenly sent.=C2=A0

=
On Jan 20, 2018 00:56, "Creative Care Servi= ces" <comcaresvcs@gmail.co= m> wrote:
As Riley has said, there is much room to discuss how=C2=A0

On Jan 19, 20= 18 19:24, "Riley Martinez-Lynch" <shunpiker@gmail.com> wrote:
I vote no on this motion, which I understand to be numbered as 5.=

I=E2=80=99d like to add that I would like to work= on distinguishing the official publications of LLG from content which is n= ot official, and that I think that adding a disclaimer to web pages is not = an adequate solution. As guskant has pointed out, there are other channels = that someone who is not overly familiar with lojban or LLG might confuse wi= th official organs of LLG.

I get the firm impressi= on that there is a consensus to address this issue, which is to say, while = opinions vary about how grave the problem is, I have yet to hear an argumen= t that we should leave things exactly as they are. I think that we can do b= etter than formal resolutions that originate in the course of a confusing e= mail discussion, and if I am wrong and we can=E2=80=99t, it=E2=80=99s possi= ble to legislate later, once we understand why it=E2=80=99s necessary to do= it that way.

=E2=80=94Riley

<= div>
On Jan 17, 2018, at 4:52 PM, Adam Lopres= to <adamlopr= esto@gmail.com> wrote:

I vote Nay= .

On Sat, Jan 13, 2018 a= t 4:11 PM Creative Care Services <comcaresvcs@gmail.com> wrote:
I now open this topic to a vote on = the following proposal:

All non-official pages or content on *.lojban.org=C2=A0must contain a disclaimer stating, at l= east, that the website is owned and managed by voluntary
=

people,= and that the marked contents are not necessarily harmonized with the offic= ial design of Lojban and may not reflect, let alone perfectly comply with, = official specifications of the same.

Voting will be closed no sooner than noon on January 16= , 2018 GMT.

On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 1:20 AM, Curtis Franks <curtis= .w.franks@gmail.com> wrote:

<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Jan 5, 2018 03:20, "Creative Care Service= s" <comc= aresvcs@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you, Pierre.

We now have a motion on the floor that has been made a= nd seconded. I ask that all discussion of this motion, and only such discus= sion take place in this thread. As a point, since we have people in attenda= nce who are not officially members I am making it clear that anyone can mak= e comments, post ideas, respond to ideas and proposals, and ask questions. = We appreciate your interest.=C2=A0

Discussion will be open until 12:00 noon GMT on January 9, 2018,= or until it appears to me that the discussion is no longer active before t= hen. Other discussions will continue in other threads. Because my intent is= to complete this meeting fairly soon without having to push topics to the = next meeting just because of time I would like to carry out similar process= es in parallel I ask for a ruling on the appropriatness of such action.=C2= =A0

Thank you.=C2=A0

.karis.=C2=A0

On Jan 5, 2018 02:11, "Pier= re Abbat" <p= hma@bezitopo.org> wrote:
On Friday, January 5, 2018 1:46:41 AM EST Creative Care= Services wrote:
> Ok, with multiple seconds it is necessary to clarify which motion we w= ill
> be voting on and whether at least one second is specifically for that<= br> > motion.
>
> I therefore am restating what the first motion was :
>
> Curtis moved that, " I move that: All non-official pages or conte= nt on *.
> lojban.org must contain a disclaimer stating, at least, that the we= bsite is
> owned and man= aged by voluntary people, and that the marked contents are not
> necessarily harmonized with the official design of Lojban and may not<= br> > reflect, let alone perfectly comply with, official specifications of t= he
> same."
>
> Is there a second for this only?

I second this.

Pierre

--
loi mintu se ckaji danlu cu jmaji


_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-= members


_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-= members


_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-= members


_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-= members
_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing= list
Llg-me= mbers@lojban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo= /llg-members


________________= _______________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-= members

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