Received: from localhost ([::1]:35586 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aaNfM-0004eQ-Hd; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 05:15:12 -0800 Received: from mail-wm0-f44.google.com ([74.125.82.44]:33529) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aaNfH-0004dK-9l for llg-members@lojban.org; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 05:15:11 -0800 Received: by mail-wm0-f44.google.com with SMTP id l68so36223286wml.0 for ; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 05:15:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=0BAjI/6GgArorTAGU6b8Ok0Lw96EdSgno4uId0Fxnrk=; b=guG3y96tai20va1O4U9khDApvUhs50gV0zIWcYp3dhkQmYboH/UoEeZwlYMKFmSsLd iIXEGJlquIAgI6gfZz/3909rpxX1wierRItJgp52q7JYPIUZZaWYE46vQlV7KB9SriWS vGTQPg99909nFv0w/AT13K+TFJFKAkznDyXmOrO9K1lT1D0rpOGNakWo1yTjRveIp1tB D9T318GEw/cZ/N2GBdSw8pLto4izLzngJGTR/R2e5PYWo/Uzan59B10Vj669woujmJ9v qcyRK/tFlhHkYjVBqKvBOY70Z3nfBcvG4jsw5H0C6DgF7+fNeugys1H1crAnGWmO7/7l JOgg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=0BAjI/6GgArorTAGU6b8Ok0Lw96EdSgno4uId0Fxnrk=; b=aUun5XZLe//KerPHjC5bPtDtqSO0w/6CPtQccBvGtka3lCYFdkvTtg0p3RQ9GENwMv SDmvRzVRIXRlrq0q+Hu5nh8/PBai7ZSSkOYkJS9b/5HiOvl3EN2dz+IhqbdU8XcQ/iPf CP9EA1nuVz1Lu3z/9jW3FL2bb/JzGT9I7Nx9MMHp7df6JzdG5j8doTWMcntbUQOnlOS8 Q5eWY2xhB6VI4MI0BMLUphRcaH7P0xpvS0+yT8eDFXt8fwTMkHjdVfKH+nEnffFzfr2L L5fxTGKGHLrYqxepqWZOI2DsgDhbOZUWhxexdt/lXTmKO6B41uak+ZXudk6UWq+zp4s2 gkBA== X-Gm-Message-State: AD7BkJJoNaw/yb7kIIyWeHnE8RXD3k+UMapc4ZEGC5A1Hma1LrXA7ePA4CxgntYYix48wQnyeTrdiudktciGWA== X-Received: by 10.28.194.68 with SMTP id s65mr10779387wmf.65.1456751700702; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 05:15:00 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.28.91.210 with HTTP; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 05:14:21 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <56D43C1B.8030802@lojban.org> References: <4D74856F-2DE5-4D2D-B748-86FE1EA42ECC@gmail.com> <56D43C1B.8030802@lojban.org> From: Gleki Arxokuna Date: Mon, 29 Feb 2016 16:14:21 +0300 Message-ID: To: llg-members@lojban.org X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / Subject: Re: [Llg-members] Demand for depriving Gleki of his administratorship and of official-pretending accounts. X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============7239274818309689455==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============7239274818309689455== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114b095ca58a08052ce86ffb --001a114b095ca58a08052ce86ffb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 2016-02-29 15:39 GMT+03:00 Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG < lojbab@lojban.org>: > Note that since Robin was Secretary/Treasurer for the last decade and a > half, the Board doesn't even know whether lojban.org is owned by LLG or > by Robin himself. Nor do we know the ownership of similar named URLs ( > lojban.com, lojban.edu, lojban.biz, etc, which we might have a legitimate > claim to - at one time a couple of these were donated to us, but I don't > know if they were ever used). > An excerpt of a private conversation a few months ago: 11:49 coi. btw, who is in charge of not losing lojban.org, lojban.com etc. addresses? mukti or you? 11:50 Me 11:52 I get email from our registrar well in advance. 11:52 And I take that particular email *very* seriously. 11:53 Losing lojban.org would *SUCK*. 11:53 it will immediately be bought by bots. 11:53 Exactly that, yes. 11:53 s/will/would/ 11:53 Like, instantly. 11:53 I believe I have it on auto-renew, in fact. 11:54 Indeed. Regarding https://github.com/lojban/ It's owned by 24 people, including Riley (our Treasurer). Some owners are not even LLG members as you may guess from that number. The https://github.com/lojban/cll/tree/docbook-prince branch could be made kinda official. But in practice if an account of one of those 24 people is hacked we can do nothing to restore our repositories there. So I think it's better to store all those repositories backed up on our (or Robin's at this period of history) servers. I don't see why other branches of the same repository must be official. I made a proposal to BPFK to make one official but even that was largely ignored (which I think doesn't matter provided that unofficial preparations are done somewhere and the results of such activities are public). And it wasn't even LLG. It'd be also nice to share LLG Youtube accounts, Reddit, Facebook and Twitter accounts between several LLG members so that they can post and reply to questions. Maybe some rules should be developed. Note that the Treasurer now possesses accounts to Youtube/Gmail and Twitter. As for other mentioned websites they are even more unofficial. I'd suggest first concentrate one lojban.org and mw.lojban.org in particular and pages published there. I think Robin is still the best person to own those domains. As for the status of officiality I suggest just making an agreement outside legal language. In short, I think we all can make to an agreement of our behavior on de facto Robin's websites. I'm pretty sure it won't be nice to ask Robin to pass us those domains (see my excerpt). Who among us knows technical details better than he does? P.S. by they way, why not start a new rival site at lojban.com? any volunteers? E.g. it can be made more polished than the current "wiki" one. Imagine a static website with nice menus, nice and complete website structure, with subdomains for speakers of different languages. --001a114b095ca58a08052ce86ffb Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= 2016-02-29 15:39 GMT+03:00 Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG <l= ojbab@lojban.org>:
Note that since Robin was Secretary/Treasur= er for the last decade and a half, the Board doesn't even know whether = lojban.o= rg is owned by LLG or by Robin himself.=C2=A0 Nor do we know the owners= hip of similar named URLs (lojban.com, lojban.edu, lojban.biz, etc, which we might have= a legitimate claim to - at one time a couple of these were donated to us, = but I don't know if they were ever used).

A= n excerpt of a private conversation a few months ago:

= 11:49 <gleki> coi. btw, who is in charge of not losing lojban.org, lojban.com etc. addresses? mukti or you?
11:50 <r= lpowell> Me
11:52 <rlpowell> I get= email from our registrar well in advance.
11:52 <rlpowell> And I take that particular email *very* seriousl= y.
11:53 <rlpowell> Losing lojban.org would *SUCK*.
11:53 <gleki> it will immediately be bought by bots.
11:53 <rlpowell> Exactly that, yes.
11:53 <gleki> s/will/would/
11:53 <rlpowell> Like, instantly.
11:53 <rlpowell> I believe I have it on auto-renew, in fact.=
11:54 <rlpowell> Indeed.



It's owned by 24 people, including Riley (our T= reasurer). Some owners are not even LLG members as you may guess from that = number.
The=C2=A0https://github.com/lojban/cll/tree/docb= ook-prince branch could be made kinda official.
But in practice if an account of one of those 24 people is hacked = we can do nothing to restore our repositories there.

So I think it's better t= o store all those repositories backed up on our (or Robin's at this per= iod of history) servers.

I don't see why other branches of the same repositor= y must be official. I made a proposal to BPFK to make one official but even= that was largely ignored (which I think doesn't matter provided that u= nofficial preparations are done somewhere and the results of such activitie= s are public). And it wasn't even LLG.
=
It'd be also nice to share LLG You= tube accounts, Reddit, Facebook and Twitter accounts between several LLG me= mbers so that they can post and reply to questions. Maybe some rules should= be developed.

Note that the Treasurer now possesses accounts to Youtube/Gmail an= d Twitter.
As for other mentioned websites = they are even more unofficial.

I'd suggest first concentrate one lojban.org and mw.lo= jban.org in particular and pages published there.
I think Robin is still the best person to own those domains.

As for th= e status of officiality I suggest just making an agreement outside legal la= nguage.
In short, I think we all can make t= o an agreement of our behavior on de facto Robin's websites.

I'm pretty s= ure it won't be nice to ask Robin to pass us those domains (see my exce= rpt). Who among us knows technical details better than he does?

P.S.=C2=A0by they= way, why not start a new rival site at lojba= n.com? any volunteers? E.g. it can be made more polished than the curre= nt "wiki" one. Imagine a static website with nice menus, nice and= complete website structure, with subdomains for speakers of different lang= uages.
--001a114b095ca58a08052ce86ffb-- --===============7239274818309689455== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Llg-members mailing list Llg-members@lojban.org http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members --===============7239274818309689455==--