Received: from localhost ([::1]:47811 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org)
	by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.76)
	(envelope-from <wikineurotic-bounces@lojban.org>)
	id 1S8uXq-00083T-Ea; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 07:23:46 -0700
Received: from 173-13-139-235-sfba.hfc.comcastbusiness.net
 ([173.13.139.235]:46474 helo=digitalkingdom.org)
 by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.76)
 (envelope-from <apache@digitalkingdom.org>) id 1S8uXk-00082b-3I
 for wikineurotic@lojban.org; Sat, 17 Mar 2012 07:23:45 -0700
Received: by digitalkingdom.org (sSMTP sendmail emulation);
 Sat, 17 Mar 2012 07:23:39 -0700
From: "Apache" <apache@digitalkingdom.org>
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2012 07:23:39 -0700
To: wikineurotic@lojban.org
X-PHP-Originating-Script: 48:htmlMimeMail.php
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <m119bf.8ipnge@www.lojban.org>
X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++)
X-Spam_score: 2.6
X-Spam_score_int: 26
X-Spam_bar: ++
X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software,
 running on the system "stodi.digitalkingdom.org", has
 identified this incoming email as possible spam.  The original message
 has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label
 similar future email.  If you have any questions, see
 the administrator of that system for details.
 Content preview: The page Synonyms was changed by najrut at 14:23 UTC You can
 view the page by following this link: http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Synonyms
 [...] Content analysis details:   (2.6 points, 5.0 required)
 pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
 1.6 RCVD_IN_BRBL_LASTEXT   RBL: RCVD_IN_BRBL_LASTEXT
 [173.13.139.235 listed in bb.barracudacentral.org]
 0.4 RDNS_DYNAMIC           Delivered to internal network by host with
 dynamic-looking rDNS
 0.6 TO_NO_BRKTS_DYNIP      To: misformatted and dynamic rDNS
Subject: [Wikineurotic] Wiki page Synonyms changed by najrut
X-BeenThere: wikineurotic@lojban.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14
Precedence: list
Reply-To: webmaster@lojban.org
List-Id: <wikineurotic.lojban.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/options/wikineurotic>,
 <mailto:wikineurotic-request@lojban.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.lojban.org/pipermail/wikineurotic/>
List-Post: <mailto:wikineurotic@lojban.org>
List-Help: <mailto:wikineurotic-request@lojban.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/wikineurotic>,
 <mailto:wikineurotic-request@lojban.org?subject=subscribe>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Errors-To: wikineurotic-bounces@lojban.org

The page Synonyms was changed by najrut at 14:23 UTC

You can view the page by following this link:
 
http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Synonyms

You can view a diff back to the previous version by following this link: 
http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-pagehistory.php?page=Synonyms&compare=1&oldver=4&newver=5


***********************************************************
The changes in this version follow below, followed after by the current full page text.
***********************************************************


+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
@@ -Lines: 68-72 changed to +Lines: 68-73 @@
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
* ''other borderline examples?''
----
- 
+ botpi = se gacri<br />----
cilre tadni ctuca





***********************************************************
The new page content follows below.
***********************************************************

''In popular literary acceptation, and as employed in special dictionaries of such words, synonyms are words sufficiently alike in general signification to be liable to be confounded, but yet so different in special definition as to require to be distinguished.'' --G. P. Marsh.



----

It would be nice to provide each of the gismu clusters below with an advice on good usage

----

__se papri | cukta | se tcidu | datni__



[http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9717|A recent proposal] by ((Nick Nicholas)): ''se papri < cukta < se tcidu < datni''



The proposal is retracted, but the fine semantics of these gismu is obviously something that should be made explicit ''(and probably has been :-( : [http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9402/msg00081.html])''



*Is a blank notebook a ''cukta'', a ''se tcidu'' or a ''datni''?

*Is a pictures only book a ''se tcidu'' or a ''datni''?

*Is a text of random words a ''datni''?



----

__klama | muvdu | litru__



''klama'' has all the places of ''muvdu'' plus x5 for vehicle, hence ''klama < muvdu''.



''litru'' lacks places for destination and origin, hence ''klama < litru'' __surely this should be the other way around? mi'e filip.__

----

__nelci | se pluka | prami| se dirba__



''prami'' differs from others in greater degree of emotional attachment. By the way, is there any difference between ''prami'' and ''se dirba''?



''se pluka'', compared to ''nelci'', has the place x3 'under conditions'. is there any reasonable way to make it work?

*there is also ''melbi'' which is similar to ''pluka''. We need to do more thorough work on this cluster --najrut

----

__drata | frica__



roda rode zo'u le du'u da de frica cu nibli le du'u da de drata

ijeku'i le du'u da de drata na nibli le du'u da de frica

i mu'a ''lo djacu dirgo na frica lo drata''



''drata'' = 'another' (not the same one), opposite to ''mintu''

''frica'' = 'different' (not of the same kind), opposite to ''dunli''



see [http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1954



----

__mintu] | dunli__



''mintu'' = same, identical, opposite to ''drata''

''dunli'' = of the same kind, opposite to ''frica''

----

__pikta | jaspu__



Are the following ''pikta'' or ''jaspu'' (or neither):

* foreign passport

* driver's licence

* a university's diploma

* marriage certificate

* credit card

* ''other borderline examples?''

----

__molki | fanri__



The gismu definition list says: '''molki'', unlike ''fanri'', need not produce a product'. However, even the prototypical grain mill for ''molki'' can be argued to produce flour from grain. Maybe ''molki'' puts more stress on processing/treatment rather than producing something radically different. But where does the border lie?



Are the following ''molki'' or ''fanri'' (or neither):

* grain mill

* foundry

* oil station

* hairdresser's saloon

* tattoo studio

* tailor's workshop

* ''other borderline examples?''

----

botpi = se gacri

----

cilre tadni ctuca



bacru tavla casnu cusku skicu



cpacu lebna te dunda=terdu'a



frati spuda



notci pinka xatra



zgana catlu viska



karce marce carce



gasnu rinka bapli zukte



mokca jipno



flecu rirxe



djuno krici fatci



krefu rapli



mukti krinu nibli rinka



simla simsu __should this be ''simlu simsa''? mi'e filip__



sanmi cidja se citka



dertu terdi gugde tutra tumla



tricu mudri



pagbu spisa



palta palne



sraku guska katna



grasu matne



ganse sanji



ratni kantu selci



jdari tinsa sligu ranti ralci



parbi frinu



cenba galfi stika



curve jinsa



tabno kolme



bancu ragve sepli  (se ragve=te sepli?)



ckana matci kicne



dargu klaji



zbasu finti



xamgu zabna



xlali palci ?mabla



zbepi tsina ?matci ?ckana



cabra minji tutci



jivbu nivji



burna cfipu ?xanka ?badri



badri dunku



xanka burna



manci spaji jenca



fanza raktu cfipu ?xanka



rigni xebni



cnano fadni kampu



bandu snura



bebna fenki cizra



nupre kajde



stidi friti



kucli | se cinri



xajmi zdile



zungi xenru



pikci cpedu



vecnu ve jdima = veldi'a



pruce te cupra = terpra



damba jamna



turni | se tutra



xabju | se zdani



ckini srana


_______________________________________________
Wikineurotic mailing list
Wikineurotic@lojban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/wikineurotic