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On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:19 PM, Robin Lee Powell <
rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote:

>
> I would like to define the defaults for {za'u} and {me'i} to be
> "contextually specified, usually the current value for the thing
> under discussion", rather than {pa}.
>

As far as I know, the default for "me'i" is "ro", not "pa". "me'i ro" =
"not all", is one of the four Aristotelian quantifiers (ro, no, su'o and
me'i). I wouldn't change it.


> Two reasons:
>
> 1.  {za'u} and {su'o} mean almost exactly the same thing as
> currently defined, similarily {me'i} and {su'e}.  Freaking annoying.
>
>
They correspond to >, >=, < and <=.



> 2.  Everybody uses them that way anyways; see {za'u re'u}, which is
> very common, and has almost no meaning without this change:
> http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za'ure'u?showall=y and
> http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za'u%20re'u?showall=y
>
>
"za'u re'u" means the same as "za'u pa re'u", i.e. "for
other-than-the-first time" = "again".


> In addition, it would give me a clean way to say "I need more flour
> for this cake", or whatever.


 I don't think this is the same as "za'u (some number)". If you already
have three cups of flour, when you say you need "more flour", couldn't you
mean you need one more cup, which is less than what you already have, less
than the current number, not more?

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:19 PM, Robin Lee Powell <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org" target=3D"_blank">rlpowell@digit=
alkingdom.org</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
I would like to define the defaults for {za&#39;u} and {me&#39;i} to be<br>
&quot;contextually specified, usually the current value for the thing<br>
under discussion&quot;, rather than {pa}.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><d=
iv style>As far as I know, the default for &quot;me&#39;i&quot; is &quot;ro=
&quot;, not &quot;pa&quot;. &quot;me&#39;i ro&quot; =3D &quot;not all&quot;=
, is one of the four Aristotelian quantifiers (ro, no, su&#39;o and me&#39;=
i). I wouldn&#39;t change it.</div>
<div>=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;=
border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Two reasons:<br>
<br>
1. =A0{za&#39;u} and {su&#39;o} mean almost exactly the same thing as<br>
currently defined, similarily {me&#39;i} and {su&#39;e}. =A0Freaking annoyi=
ng.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div style>They correspond to &gt;, &gt;=3D=
, &lt; and &lt;=3D.</div><div><br></div><div>=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex">

2. =A0Everybody uses them that way anyways; see {za&#39;u re&#39;u}, which =
is<br>
very common, and has almost no meaning without this change:<br>
<a href=3D"http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za&#39;ure&#39;u?showall=
=3Dy" target=3D"_blank">http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za&#39;ure&#=
39;u?showall=3Dy</a> and<br>
<a href=3D"http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za&#39;u%20re&#39;u?showa=
ll=3Dy" target=3D"_blank">http://corpus.lojban.org/corpus/search/za&#39;u%2=
0re&#39;u?showall=3Dy</a><br>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div style>&quot;za&#39;u re&#39;u&quot; me=
ans the same as &quot;za&#39;u pa re&#39;u&quot;, i.e. &quot;for other-than=
-the-first time&quot; =3D &quot;again&quot;.=A0</div><div>=A0</div><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc s=
olid;padding-left:1ex">

In addition, it would give me a clean way to say &quot;I need more flour<br=
>
for this cake&quot;, or whatever.</blockquote><div><br></div><div style>=A0=
I don&#39;t think this is the same as &quot;za&#39;u (some number)&quot;. I=
f you already have three cups of flour, when you say you need &quot;more fl=
our&quot;, couldn&#39;t you mean you need one more cup, which is less than =
what you already have, less than the current number, not more?</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e xorxes</div><div style><b=
r></div></div></div></div>

<p></p>

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