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Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 00:02:19 +0100
From: Ilmen <ilmen.pokebip@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bpfk] {ro}, existential import and De Morgan
References: <c2b90d96-7b89-4633-bc33-6e42b16d705c@googlegroups.com> <20141018011419.GF12268@mercury.ccil.org> <97AABFB42A204E5D97A4EDFEA57A8508@gmail.com> <20141019012930.GF12991@mercury.ccil.org> <676B49242B0D4F6A986D6AFEA1EB3B3C@gmail.com> <20141019170808.GJ12991@mercury.ccil.org> <c610baca-170b-480d-aa30-a26e2c6fc793@googlegroups.com> <20141109004632.GL6360@mercury.ccil.org> <CACf3dPkHuWfRwr1MxeZmRTfbE1TkkHER7WxUmo7FewKUCZ1jog@mail.gmail.com> <acbd142e-f5ec-4e49-ae5c-0da8cb1b3813@googlegroups.com>
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As for {ro} and existential import, I would like to highlight that if=20
{ro} never implies existential import by itself, there is still a very=20
simple way to add the existential import nuance: {ro su'o (pa)}.
In CLL Chapter 18 Section 8 <https://lojban.github.io/cll/18/8/> Example=20
18, it is shown how {ro} can be combined with another number, implying=20
that {ro} and this other number have the same value:

8.18)   mi viska le rore gerku
        I saw the all-of/two dogs.
        I saw both dogs.


In a similar way, {ro su'o (pa) da} would mean "everything, which is at=20
least one thing".

Another similar option =E2=80=94although longer=E2=80=94 could be {vei ro .=
e su'o (pa) da}.

mi'e la .ilmen. mu'o


On 09/11/2014 19:34, mukti wrote:
> On Sunday, November 9, 2014 9:42:50 AM UTC-3, And Rosta wrote:
>
>     1. What does ro mean, and does it have EI? (A question settled a
>     dozen years ago.)
>     2. Should there be a non-EI universal quantifier?
>     3. Should there be an EI universal quantifier? This is the
>     question John seems to be addressing.
>
>     4. In any bpfk revision of the CLL specification, which meaning
>     should be paired with the phonological form /ro/?
>
> I believe that #1 and #4 are the question I'm trying to ask -- which=20
> hopefully have the same answer -- and I'm sorry if I invited the=20
> detour into other questions.
>

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<html>
  <head>
    <meta content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3D"Content-Type=
">
  </head>
  <body text=3D"#000000" bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">
    As for {ro} and existential import, I would like to highlight that
    if {ro} never implies existential import by itself, there is still a
    very simple way to add the existential import nuance: {ro su'o
    (pa)}.<br>
    In <a href=3D"https://lojban.github.io/cll/18/8/">CLL Chapter 18
      Section 8</a> Example 18, it is shown how {ro} can be combined
    with another number, implying that {ro} and this other number have
    the same value:<br>
    <div><br>
    </div>
    <div>
      <pre class=3D"" dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"codebox" style=3D"font-family:'Cour=
ier New',Courier,monospace;line-height:1.2em;padding:1em;margin-top:0px;mar=
gin-bottom:0px;border:1px solid rgb(105,105,105);overflow:auto;border-top-r=
ight-radius:3px;border-bottom-left-radius:3px;border-bottom-right-radius:3p=
x;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:12px;background:rgb(245,245,245)"><big><big><a=
 id=3D"e18" name=3D"e18">8.18)</a>  mi viska le rore gerku
       I saw the all-of/two dogs.
       I saw both dogs.</big></big>
</pre>
    </div>
    <div><br>
    </div>
    In a similar way, {ro su'o (pa) da} would mean "everything, which is
    at least one thing".<br>
    <br>
    Another similar option =E2=80=94although longer=E2=80=94 could be {vei =
ro .e su'o
    (pa) da}.<br>
    <br>
    mi'e la .ilmen. mu'o<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class=3D"moz-cite-prefix">On 09/11/2014 19:34, mukti wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite=3D"mid:acbd142e-f5ec-4e49-ae5c-0da8cb1b3813@googlegroups.com"
      type=3D"cite">
      <div dir=3D"ltr">On Sunday, November 9, 2014 9:42:50 AM UTC-3, And
        Rosta wrote:
        <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left:
          0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">
          <p dir=3D"ltr">
            1. What does ro mean, and does it have EI? (A question
            settled a dozen years ago.)<br>
            2. Should there be a non-EI universal quantifier?<br>
            3. Should there be an EI universal quantifier? This is the
            question John seems to be addressing.=C2=A0</p>
        </blockquote>
        <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0;margin-left:
          0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">
          <p dir=3D"ltr">4. In any bpfk revision of the CLL specification,
            which meaning should be paired with the phonological form
            /ro/?</p>
        </blockquote>
        <div>I believe that #1 and #4 are the question I'm trying to ask
          -- which hopefully have the same answer -- and I'm sorry if I
          invited the detour into other questions.</div>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
  </body>
</html>

<p></p>

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